The Lady, or the Tiger?
by Nideak on Dec 16, 2008 1:57 PM EST
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PrintAs we approach the offseason much discussion has been made about who the Colts should and should not resign. A lot of the debate revolves around two specific players, Jeff Saturday and Kelvin Hayden.
So let's say you're the Colts' GM. You can only sign one player under the salary cap. Do you choose the veteran center who knows all of the calls, is an extension of the QB. The vital clog to an otherwise shaky offensive line? Or do you choose the cornerback. The 2nd round pick that has blossomed into an occasionally dominant player. He's big. He's physical. He can catch the ball. He can tackle (This is all stuff I'd have said if I didn't watch the Lions game, so lets just pretend it didnt happen, right Kelvin?:P). He's also young.
Who do you pick? Note, I'm not calling either one of them ladies.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Stampede Blue's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Stampede Blue's writers or editors.
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Hayden
1. Saturday is older and at the end of his career.
2. We drafted three interior linemen last year, and Jamey Richard will be fine next year.
3. Hayden would give us the best secondary in the league by far. With Bethea, Sanders, Hayden, Jackson, Bullitt, Giordano, Jennings, Rushing, and Coe, we would be impossible to pass on. I would like to keep this defense together.
http://naptownsfinest.com
Agreed
As much as I would miss a guy like Saturday, if we couldn’t get a deal worked out for everyone, then Saturday is the guy to go. I realize that he’s been invaluable this year as far as the line calls go, but Manning and Richard have had a good amount of time this year, and a full training camp for the both of them will inevitably create the chemistry they need. Richard won’t immediately replace Saturday, but why draft 3 lineman if you’re not ready to use them? This probably won’t make me popular, but I would argue that the guy we miss the most on the line this year is Lilja. Even with Saturday in, we’ve only had a few games where we produced with the run. Also, look at what Jake Scott has done in Tennessee, he’s a bit missed as well. All said though, we’re top heavy on offense in terms of money, and we need to spend a bit more on D. By the way, after seeing Hayden run back an interception in the Super Bowl, and another this year, why hasn’t there been more talk of him as a Return man? Is it because we use him so much on D, or a speed problem? I mean, if we’re willing to put Ratliff out there, why not Hayden?
Question:
Can we assume that they release Marvin, leavinvg more cap space, ensuring us the ability to have both Saturday AND Hayden? :D please?
"I throw, you catch. It's NOT that hard!"
Peyton Manning, SNL, 2007
And
I don’t think Saturday is going to be as expensive as some might think.
"I throw, you catch. It's NOT that hard!"
Peyton Manning, SNL, 2007
by peytonsthebest on Dec 16, 2008 2:58 PM EST up reply actions
funny
who would have thought two years ago that we would all be asking for Marvin to be cut?
http://naptownsfinest.com
I was ready to fight
anyone who said anything negative about him…until recently.
/sick with shame
"I throw, you catch. It's NOT that hard!"
Peyton Manning, SNL, 2007
by peytonsthebest on Dec 16, 2008 3:45 PM EST up reply actions
Marvin
I feel your pain. Marvin is probably my favorite Colt of all time, but at the same time I have to be a realist and I wouldn’t be terribly surprised if Marvin’s last game in Indy is against the Titans. Glad I don’t have to make the decision…
Going to have to cut...
Marvin. His cap hit next year will be 13.4 million, but if he’s cut, he’ll only count as 2 million on the cap (perhaps 1 million in 09, 1 million in 10, I think there was a recent rule change that allowed teams to spread signing bonus hits over 2 cap years)
13.4 is WAY too high for Marvin’s production this year.
I don’t know if this next year is the year Peyton’s deal is re-done. His cap hit next year will be 21.2 million, but its the last year of his signing bonus, so I’m not sure if they are just going to give him a new contract which would significantly lower his cap hit.
Clarks contract seems weird. He has a HUGE cap hit next year, but its all due to an 8 million dollar RB. I’m assuming they’ll take the RB and convert it to a SB, which would save the Colts 6MM next year and make Clark’s hits a very manageable ~7.5 million each year over the life of the contract.
Other than that, doesn’t look like any work arounds or cuttable people.
The Colts have 67 players signed past next year, but would be 3.5 million over the estimated cap hit.
All information from http://www.coltscap.net/default.php which is run by Bav, who does a great job.
09 Cap Charges From Coltscap.net
Peyton 21.2Mil
Marvin 13.4Mil
Clark 13.9Mil
Freeney 11.2Mil
Wayne 7.4Mil
Sanders 7.4Mil
Mathis 6.9Mil
Diem 6.1Mil
Brock 5.3Mil
Lilja 4.4Mil
Brackett 3.1Mil
Vinatieri 2.7Mil
Jackson 1.8Mil
Addai 1.7Mil
Sorgi 1.3Mil
Gonzalez 1.3Mil
Smith 941K
Ugoh 941K
Snow 805K
Jennings 770K
11 players 650-400K
5 Players 385K (league min)
36 Players 121Million Dollars add 17 min salary players and that’s 127.5Million. ColtsCap has the estimated 09 cap at 126mil which is around what the other estimates I found in a quick lookup were.
Cutting Marvin or him retiring would free up around 10 Million, but the Colts are likely going to need that much just to get to fill out the roster with the draft, undrafteds and low level resignings. Converting Clark’s bonus like Nideak suggested would free up some space for a big resigning, but choosing looks like it could be reality unless someone else in addition to Marvin is cut or the Cap rises more than is expected.
Shonn Greene for Heisman
Doak Walker award winner
144 yards per game
6.2 yards per carry
08 TDs per game > 06 GPA
by shake n bake on Dec 16, 2008 4:34 PM EST up reply actions
Wow
Looks like they are going to have to do something to the top 3 guys. I don’t know if Peyton’s contract can be restructured but that is a huge hit. Same with Marvin and Clark…
I think the Colts have to re-sign Saturday but I am inclined to think Polian drafted 3 OL to replace Saturday next season.
I was thinking Diem but..
There are two problems. Who do you start at RT? Charlie Johnson? I think if you’re cutting Diem, you almost HAVE to keep Saturday around, especially given Lilja’s uncertainty. Also, cutting Diem would seemingly only save 3 million on the cap (unless im reading it wrong). I don’t know if thats really enough of a savings, maybe it is. He certainly isn’t worth the $6M cap hit this year, imo.
If Saturday doesn't retire a Colt,
then there’s something askew in the cosmos.
Definitely.
"I throw, you catch. It's NOT that hard!"
Peyton Manning, SNL, 2007
by peytonsthebest on Dec 16, 2008 6:48 PM EST up reply actions
a lot of people probably said that about...
Edge, too.
And will say it about Marvin.
I hope they can resign Saturday, but I won’t be surprised if they don’t.
I'm not against Edge coming back....
"I throw, you catch. It's NOT that hard!"
Peyton Manning, SNL, 2007
by peytonsthebest on Dec 17, 2008 10:46 AM EST up reply actions
The capless season coming up will help
We won’t be losing anyone. Capitalism will be taking over the NFL, and teams like Jacksonville are screwed.
http://naptownsfinest.com
I don't think the cap is coming off
they have built uncapped years into the CBA before and it hasn’t happened yet. They do it because it’s an incentive for the owners not to let the CBA get close to running out causing a strike/lockout. Small Market Owners want no part of an uncapped NFL, The few big market owners would be able to win more games, but would be reducing their personal profits so they will be more accepting of a cap than the small market owners would accept a uncapped NFL. Mid Market owners would be forced to give up their shot at a title or drain their own bank account to keep the team in contention. The uncapped year isn’t in the interest of most of the owners. They aren’t just going to let it happen.
Shonn Greene for Heisman
Doak Walker award winner
144 yards per game
6.2 yards per carry
08 TDs per game > 06 GPA
by shake n bake on Dec 16, 2008 8:47 PM EST up reply actions
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