Lambasting the cheaters: More from Colts win over the 49ers
Well gosh, it looks Colts radio announcers Bob Lamey and Will Wolford weren't the only ones who caught the San Francisco 49ers cheating on Sunday. From Niners Insider, the San Francisco Chronicle's special section devoted to 49ers football, and their writer Kevin Lynch [emphasis mine]:
Colts Drive: Joseph Adai just threw a TD pass to Wayne. Great play by Wayne with a diving catch which looked good and the 49ers aren't challenging. Manning missed on the two-point conversion. Jeff Ulbrich made the trip. Nate Clements is out with a shoulder contusion. The last time they said shoulder contusion, it was Tony Pashos who's on injured reserve with broken scapula. The 49ers might have just faked a cramp by Parys Haralson to prevent being in the wrong defense
...
Colts drive: Another fake of a cramp, this time by veteran linebacker Takeo Spikes. Big pass play to Dallas Clark, 40-yarder. The Colts did the same thing that the Texans did last week on a 42-yard TD pass to Owen Daniels - play action with a throw across the field. This time Clark just beat Michael Lewis on man coverage I believe.
I wonder if some of the same people who were "disappointed" with me and others in this thread will saunter on over to Kevin Lynch's place and tell him he shouldn't write such things unless he has full, definitive proof... like, I guess, a signed confession from Mike Singletary, or a player acting as a "Deep Throat" informant, providing quotes from the early week meetings: "OK guys, if Peyton and their offense start getting on a roll, we want you to CHEAT!"
Honestly, folks. That's now two separate sources, both covering two different sides of the game (one the Colts announcers, the other a writer for the SF Chronicle) who saw the same thing: Cheating. If you need more proof than that, then I don't know what to tell you. Maybe you think the Earth is flat as well.
Mike Singletary is a cheater. Thousands of fans at Lucas Oil saw him cheat, and booed. Three members of the media are on record as seeing him do it. He did it. He tried to cheat to win a football game. Say that to yourself, and if you are STILL defending the actions of the 49ers head coach, then you are someone who lacks any kind of moral compass.
Obviously, if the "cramps" were real, then I will apologize to Singletary and the 49ers and take my lumps accordingly. However, the "cramps" didn't look real to me. They didn't look real to thousands of fans at The Luke. They didn't look real to Lamey and Wolford. They didn't look real to the SF Chronicle.
Here at Stampede Blue, we have no tolerance for cheating. None. And I defy anyone who says "It's part of the game." No, it isn't. People who cheat belittle and demean the game. Cheaters spit in the faces of John Unitas, Bart Starr, and the greats of the great. More importantly, we fans do not pay over $100 a seat, $30 for parking, and ungoldly amounts for hot dogs, popcorn, beer, and soda just so we can watch cheating.
We pay to watch football. REAL football. And real football does not involve cheating, like what we saw Singletary attempt Sunday.
Again, if you don't have the stomach to read this blog when we call a spade a spade, read something else. I'm serious. I am not someone who will hold your hand and softly explain why we chose to call an NFL head coach a "bum." If you don't get the reasons by now, I really can't help you. At this blog, we call it as we see it. We don't hold back, ESPECIALLY when cheating is involved. And since Kevin Lynch saw what Lamey and Wolford saw, 49ers fans can't simply dismiss the claim, saying "it's only the other side that's saying it." Hell, I heard even one commenter say that it wasn't Singletary who cheated, but it was likely the 49ers defensive line coach.
Really? I mean... honestly?
Make no mistake about it people, and loyal readers of this blog know this is true, if Jim Caldwell had tried to do what Singletary did during this game, I would call him a bum as well. I'd call my friends at West 56th Street and scream at them "WHEN DID IT BECOME OK TO HIRE BUMS AS THE HEAD COACH!"
Thankfully, Jim Caldwell is not a bum. He is someone who believes in the integrity of the game. Mike Singletary doesn't. Throw him in the same category as Bill Belichick, a man we Colts fans lambasted for years because he used to do the same cheap tactics with the New England Patriots. If Belichick was a cheater for doing that (and other things), then so is Singletary. If Belichick is a bum for instructing Willie McGinest to take a dive in the 2003 regular season game at Indy, then Mike Singletary is a bum for doing the same (or allowing the same) to happen yesterday with Takeo Spikes.
A spade is a spade.
Don't like it me writing that? Read something else. We call it as we see it here. If you'd prefer something else on the Internet that dodges or glances away from the truth, kindly venture to Google.com, type in "Colts blog," and have fun. I'm sure you'll find something that suits you. For everyone else here, we prefer our truth honest and without pretense. No sugar coating. No white washing. A spade is a spade.
And yes, Mike Singletary is indeed still a bum. Go Colts!
1 recs |
365 comments
|
Comments
I guess I am just disappointed. I thought better of him.
Guess who my favorite team is...
by Indcolt18 on Nov 2, 2009 8:36 AM EST via mobile reply actions 0 recs
I did too
That’s why I’m blasting the hell out of him now. So very disappointed in his pettiness.
SB Nation's Indianapolis Colts blogger at Stampede Blue. Please make an account so you can post a FanPost, make a FanShot, add some comments, and make some noise. Accounts are free, and only require an email address.
by BigBlueShoe on Nov 2, 2009 8:37 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
First of all...
I just got up and this was the very first Colts article I read this morning….and, boy, am I awake now! Funny…..My wife and I were making the exact same comments during the game and we noticed some 65,000+ football fans noticed it too. Kind of hard to deny now that they were faking it to avoid taking TO’s. Great articlle BBS!
Pressure is somethig you feel when you don't know what you're doing!
-Chuck Knoll
by thefrozz on Nov 2, 2009 8:39 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
CHEATING
i didn’t keep up with the post yesterday, so i’m not sure if anyone else noticed this. after the second half fake cramp the camera panned over to their def. coord. and you could see a hint of a knowing smirk on his face. i’m not gonna say it was Singletary who advised that, but the d-bag of a def. coach, looked quite guilty.
by tenaytiousd32 on Nov 2, 2009 8:40 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
I was curious
I was talking yesterday about the “leg cramps”.
You tend to see them toward the end of game in hot weather. I am sure you can technically get them anytime- but it was 50F at the game.
I am sure the medical people prepare for possible injuries that can be directly related to the weather. I suppose I am saying that I don’t recall seeing cramping on a cool game day with a dry field.( of course I am not a doctor)
Guess who my favorite team is...
by Indcolt18 on Nov 2, 2009 8:43 AM EST via mobile reply actions 0 recs
it happens but is very uncommon
GO COLTS!!! 09 IS OURS!!!
by TheAngelsColts on Nov 2, 2009 11:10 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Posts like this
is the reason fanblogs will dominate mainstreammedia in a few years. Excellent, hardhitting and witty journalism.
God hates the New England Patriots
by Juri on Nov 2, 2009 8:44 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Let's face it,
Most teams out there (when they play Indy) treat it as a ‘win at all costs’ game. They break out the gimmick plays, blitzes, onside kicks, etc. They basically pull out all the stops in order to try and beat the Colts. It’s almost always a playoff atmosphere. They’re always gunning for us. In fact, many teams specifically draft players to try to legitimately compete with the colts. (i.e. Houston Texans, Denver Broncos….just to name two). This has been going on for years and is totally unprecedented in NFL history. For Colts fans, it is a good position to be in…..just means our team is great. Singletary obviously took it too far, and I bet he regrets his decision. Hopefully, we won’t repeat it. I still respect the rest of the 49er team for the fight they put up. I truly expected a 25 point win. Hopefully, the Colts won’t be this ‘out of sync’ again this year.
by Ayrshire on Nov 2, 2009 8:52 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
cramps.....
are part of the reason to run the no-huddle. even if the player does go down, he has to sit out the next play. yes, everyone wants the play to go through because of the “wrong D” on the field, but missing a starter on the field is a good thing as well.
And if we’re going to talk about “cheating”, don’t forget the Colts making a last second substitution and not giving SF time to do the same. That’s “cheating” just as much as “faking” a leg cramp is.
by Evanbio on Nov 2, 2009 9:00 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
I TOTALLY AGREE
this post is completely ridiculous i can’t believe that anyone especially colts fans would stoop down to this level. this post is outrageous. and i dont know if you meant for it to be but it sounds racist to me. when you are talking about an african american coach and player “supposedly cheating” you shouldn’t use the phrase a spade is a spade. just a thought. and the niners should have won this game. it may have been cheating but no one really knows it is ridiculous to post something like this i have lost all respect for colts fans.
by metalman763 on Nov 2, 2009 11:38 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You are a little too
PC!! BBS in no way meant anything as racist. Quit reading into things that are not there…that is rediculous!!
"If me and King Kong went into an alley, only one of us would come out. And it wouldn't be the monkey."
"I don't really trust a sane person."
"I never met a man I didn't want to fight." The one and only Lyle Alzado
by TRDean on Nov 2, 2009 11:43 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah you're what's wrong with this world
trying to find a reason to get offended. Relax.
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 2, 2009 11:54 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
"The phrase predates the use of the word "spade" as an ethnic slur against African-Americans"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/To_call_a_spade_a_spade
how about backing up a claim of racism with something besides the people criticized happening to be black and the use of a common idiom.
Luck is probability taken personally, clutch is probability attributed to individuals.
by shake n bake on Nov 2, 2009 11:55 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
oh good the race card
stupid
go mavs, go colts, go rangers, go baylor
by zkmavz on Nov 2, 2009 12:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
exactly.. this orginates in victorian times
When people were excessively prudish and instead of calling it a spade (which is a type of shovel) they referred to it by silly terms like an ‘earth turning implement’.
Seems really insecure that some automatically assumes this is racial.
An expert is someone who knows more and more about less and less until they know everything about nothing...
by bluegirl on Nov 2, 2009 1:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Huh?
when you are talking about an african american coach and player "supposedly cheating" you shouldn’t use the phrase a spade is a spade
Dude, I’m black and that didn’t offend me one bit. People nowadays are too damn PC, you can’t say what you want without being labeled a racist or sexist. Relax, it isn’t that crucial.
"Do I believe in aliens?" Stephon Marbury asked. "I don't know, because I've never seen one. But I believe in Jesus because I saw him in the shower the other day."
by KMR24 on Nov 2, 2009 12:06 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
We have a black coach
Our last coach was a black coach.
Racist? Colts fans?
I mean…wow…just, wow.
by eltharion_doa on Nov 3, 2009 2:17 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Good post
But are you seriously saying that someone can’t disagree with you BBS? Someone can’t write their opinion such as accusing the 49’ers and not Singletary?
Get over yourself.
If someone has that opinion, call them out….but don’t tell them to read something else and hit the road.I give you and the other writers kudos for the hard work you put into this place, but remember, it is the difference of opinion that makes this place a blog that we are all proud of and it is the PARTICIPATION that makes it a blog and not something established. Otherwise, you’re no better than the private media that do not include the fan.
by Levante on Nov 2, 2009 9:01 AM EST reply actions 3 recs
Watching the game,
I felt they were fake cramps. It makes for good theatrics, but It soured me on Mike Singletary. It was so obvious because it happened when we were getting into a rhythm on offense.
"You can't defend the perfect throw, what can I say?" Peyton quoting Marino
"As I grow older, the list of people who can kiss my ass grows longer"-Ancient Hoosier Proverb.
by Indy Lori on Nov 2, 2009 9:02 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Keep calling it like it is BBS
That’s why I love this blog
by coltus on Nov 2, 2009 9:09 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Good insight
Felt like the 49’ers were trying to slow things down. Likely part of their game plan. Again it appears they were faking but you don’t truly know, nor does Lamey, or the SF Chronicle. Only the players know.
It seems that you are more concerned about the theatrics BBS. Feels like you are saying look at me I am right. Good for you, now lets talk about other parts of the game. Was the offensive line that bad. Notice how strong the colts defensive line was. What will the offense do this week to prepare for a strong Houston defense.
Singletary may or may not have made those calls could have been the DC. In addition Evanbio made a good point of pointing out the Colts Substitution schemes.
I guess I read this blog for good analysis and insight which is often found. The ranting however is tiresome when it raises its ugly head. Get over it and on to next week. That’s what our team does.
by colt on Nov 2, 2009 9:19 AM EST reply actions 6 recs
Thank you!!
Maybe BBS is right…big deal. Lets move on…
"If me and King Kong went into an alley, only one of us would come out. And it wouldn't be the monkey."
"I don't really trust a sane person."
"I never met a man I didn't want to fight." The one and only Lyle Alzado
by TRDean on Nov 2, 2009 9:33 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Agree
"We’re only going to score 17 points? haha...OK" - Tom Brady
by BlueMark1821 on Nov 2, 2009 10:35 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
+1
"It's the greatest job in the world until Peyton comes off the field and you think his thumb might be broken and there's three minutes left in the AFC Championship Game and you're down by three to New England and you haven't taken a snap all year. Yeah, it's a great job until that point." - Jim Sorgi
by gizzardfanny on Nov 2, 2009 11:58 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
good insight?
how about trying decaf without the half pint of jameson’s! lol. Ok, so the 49er’s did that. what do u expect from a coach who pulls his pants down in the locker room after a game and displays his true intelligence. Myabe in high school that fires ur team up but these are grown men. as far as this “rant” because thats what it is, I hope u feel better. Cheating, faking it, dogging it whatever. If there are rules broken the league will handle it and if not? We will just have to move on. The score shouldnt even had been that close, manning was off and the running game is struggling. Telling others that if they dont like your opinion they should go somewhere else will get you one thing. a few people being your yes man. i thought stampede blue was ALL colts fans. not just those who agreed with BBS. Theres ranting and rave sites for that. But even though i dont agree with what you wrote ill go ahead and agree you have the right to your opinion and that you have the right to post it. But you must be able to accept the criticism that comes and respect others rights to their opinions and views. not get mad like a child and take your toys and go home. Colts win. bottom line, room for improvement ? lots of it. just like theres always room for us all to grow.
sean smither
by izzystradlin67 on Nov 2, 2009 9:37 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
Geez, BBS
Honestly, folks. That’s now two separate sources, both covering two different sides of the game (one the Colts announcers, the other a writer for the SF Chronicle) who saw the same thing: Cheating. If you need more proof than that, then I don’t know what to tell you. Maybe you think the Earth is flat as well.
Of course it is. I have two sources that say it, so it must be true.
Or maybe, just maybe, the word “proof” doesn’t mean what you think it means.
Never approach a vast undertaking with a half-vast plan.
by szquirrel on Nov 2, 2009 9:42 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Then again...
…you don’t think Mike Singletary is going to walk up to you and tell you flatout they faked injuries, do you? I find that a little doubtful. Two additional sources, one from each side… maybe it’s not concrete proof, but it’s certainly worthwhile to consider. It’s damn sure the best we’re going to get.
by LTTelamon on Nov 2, 2009 9:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I remember Baltimore pulling that "cramp" stuff, too,
at least two of their big stars, with the Colts down near their red zone.
That time it was even more obvious because they happened on the same drive, within a couple of plays of each other, two different guys.
It was a home game, ‘cause I remember the crowd booing, and the Colts were in the hurry-up. Can’t remember what year, but probably 2004.
by HoosierHorseman on Nov 2, 2009 9:45 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
I guess it's one of those "everybody does it" kinds of cheating,
like the Pats fans like to say. Frankly, I imagine coaches like Belichek and Singletary think they’re really very clever for coming up with it.
by HoosierHorseman on Nov 2, 2009 9:49 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
I think most
including myself, agreed with you that Singletary acted like a coward in having players fake injuries. It was repulsive. It goes along the lines of Ozzie Guillen telling his pitchers to throw at batters and Gordon Bombay telling Charlie Conway to fake like he cut his eye in Mighty Ducks 1. I still have yet to forgive Bombay. I think most who were arguing with you, at least myself, thought you were focusing way too much on it instead of the win. It made you sound bitter and like a bad sport. Of course, you also didn’t have much to back yourself up on, and now you do. Nice find. Still, I think although it merits a comment, 99% of the recap should be about our team and how well they fought without so much emphasis on Singletary disappointing football fans everywhere with his complete disrespect of the game.
Second, whether you meant to or not, you called everyone who disagreed with you cowards. That was what was uncalled for and completely took all credibility out of your assessment. Not only were you wrong with your definition of “classy” and “cowardice,” but you completely acted without class by my making that comment. You have the right to call coaches out for doing what they did and can put it in whatever context you feel, whether we agree with how you put it or not. But it does not make you classy, and the way you put it, you sounded whiny and angry. Then you went on to call people who thought you were out of line cowards. So rather than back up your reasoning in a respectful way, you took a shot at both fan bases and made yourself look like a complete dick.
I think you do a fantastic job on this blog and enjoy reading and commenting on it, and will continue to do so. I agree with you a lot, and disagree with you a lot. Other fans who enjoy this blog will disagree with you at times, but that is part of the job description. Yet, just because they do, there is no need to become bitter and angry and start taking shots at people in your own fanbase.
by npb1985 on Nov 2, 2009 9:50 AM EST reply actions 8 recs
GREAT POST
I was typing something up, then I read this. I disagree with nothing npb1985 wrote.
by WaynesWorld on Nov 3, 2009 10:44 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Why is the focus on the fake cramps
And not the performance of the Defense, or the offensive line’s struggles, or Bob being back and playing 41 plays, or Coach Caldwell starting 7-0?? It’s ridiculous to call Singletary a bum and question his integrity based on this. He’s a veteran of the league, one of the premier players of any generation, and a hall of famer that has never had his integrity called in to question. Unfortunately this is another case of BBS jumping off on a point and making sure that anyone who thinks counter to his case is a moron, coward, or just doesn’t know football or lacks facts.
I thank DZ and Demond over at 18to88 for handling this the right way…mention it as disappointing, move on, and focus the praise on the team for their guts and growth as we jump out to a 7-0 start to the season.
by indy15 on Nov 2, 2009 9:55 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
my thoughts exactly
sorry I didn’t read your comment before (that makes my comment below entirely pointless)
Its true, there are a bunch of interesting things from the game and the highlight is one that really didn’t matter. Not to mention that Singletary is one of the keys for turning the 49ers into the competitor they are now. He’s one of the greatest players the league has ever seen and all of a sudden, he’s a bum for something we don’t know for sure, but since two sources say it, then its true. Big deal, move on. I still respect that guy, but maybe I have to read something else for not agreeing he’s a bum…
"We’re only going to score 17 points? haha...OK" - Tom Brady
by BlueMark1821 on Nov 2, 2009 10:51 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
"49ers might have just faked" is proof??
Don’t ever serve on a jury, dude. Guilt or innocence is not something built on a firm foundation of evidence in your mind.
Color me disappointed. I thought you were a more rigorous thinker than that.
------
"How can a pickup truck contain enough mass to unfold into a towering machine? I say if Ringling Brothers can get 15 clowns into a Volkswagen, anything is possible."
by E.M.H. on Nov 2, 2009 10:04 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
Or be a judge...
Two sports writers speculating on what happened is far from any proof. And who’s to say that Singletary made his players fake injuries, instead of the players taking initiative. Everybody knows the Colts try to sub quickly w/o allowing the opposing team time to ‘counter-sub.’ And every defense has a right to sub when the offense does. The refs do a poor job at managing this. Whether the injuries are faked or not, the 49ers have the right to make sure they have the correct personnel.
by shulkdog on Nov 3, 2009 7:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Several teams do the cramping
and I hate to see it. I enjoy reading everyone’s views, analysis and opinions on here. The Defense answered the bell after the long Gore run. The Offense looked out of sync but scored when it mattered at the end of the game.
The over-the-top tirades are old. It makes you sound whiny.
by Gwen on Nov 2, 2009 10:22 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Not the point.
Do I think they faked the cramps? Yes. Do we need to spend an entire day harping on it after the Colts WON THE GAME? No. If punshment is due, the league will handle it. I have always been proud of the Colts as an organization and their fans for being welcoming hosts and good stewards of the league. Beating this topic into the ground reeks of pettiness! It didn’t inflict any injuries on our players and ultimately had no effect on the outcome. Move on. Next game.
by invisibulman on Nov 2, 2009 10:43 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Amazing how the story of this game
is cheating, and not the defensive stands on our side, or the different ways for winning this team is capable of finding. Or even how the SF defense caused big trouble to the Colts.
From a bunch of interesting subjects, you picked one that resulted in NOTHING.
"We’re only going to score 17 points? haha...OK" - Tom Brady
by BlueMark1821 on Nov 2, 2009 10:43 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
BBS's whole freaking point...
…was that cheating, win or lose, demeans the integrity of the game. WE would be cowards if we simply ignored it because our team won. What sort of garbage is that? Discussing the questionable acts of the opposing team’s coach in no way detracts from the Colts’ stellar defensive play. Heck, the game could have gone either way yesterday. SF is a good team. But when their head coach/defensive line coach is engaging in cheating in an attempt to gain an upper hand, that belittles and cheapens the game we as fans pay a shit ton of money to enjoy. That sort of crap goes beyond winning or losising; beyond any defensive stand. Cheating pisses me off. It pisses BBS off. It should also piss you off. I don’t spend my Sundays watching football because its rigged or ripe with cheating. I watch it because I expect a fair game from both teams (and the officials). The day we as fans aren’t getting that from the league is the day we might as well be watching pro “wrestling”.
by IBelieve1237 on Nov 2, 2009 10:50 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
True, cheating ain't right
True, it pisses me off too, and, in case it is really proven that they cheated, then the league has to their thing. But for now, as BBS said yesterday when we all “chciken littles” we’re all “freaking out”, you guys need to take it easy, move on. Of course cheating is a big deal, I’m not trying to take importance from it or from the morals of the game. But come on, nothing really happened and it ain’t that certain that it was cheating. I wouldn’t take injuries that easily and start calling Singletary a bum or, while in a rant, start sending people who DISAGREE to read some other stuff. We won, they lost, even when they cheated (again, not certain) Let’s move into the next game which again, will be the toughest one so far.
"We’re only going to score 17 points? haha...OK" - Tom Brady
by BlueMark1821 on Nov 2, 2009 11:04 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
besides, I do like pro “wrestling”
:)
"We’re only going to score 17 points? haha...OK" - Tom Brady
by BlueMark1821 on Nov 2, 2009 11:09 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I thought that there were rules built into the system to prevent 'fake injury' cheating.
It was my impression that a player whose injury required a break in the action had to stay off the field for the rest of the drive, or, at least, several downs.
Is that not the case?
by hahasound on Nov 2, 2009 10:55 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
I believe the rule is just one play
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 2, 2009 11:14 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Ok…I think faking an injury is b.s and bush league, but isn’t it a given that it isn’t a rarity to see it in an NFL game for various reasons? Bottom line, Colts won despite the b.s. and the next time we play the 49er’s, Mike Singletary will probably be at home reflecting on his short career as an NFL head coach. So on to next week, Colts are going up against one of the best receivers in the league and the status of one of our top cover corners is unknown, at least I dont know it….What’s up with Hayden? Can we talk about things that actually mean something?
by colts78 on Nov 2, 2009 10:56 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Hayden hasn't been the same since that
injury. He’s been out of his zone sometimes and to me he has looked kinda slow in some plays.
"We’re only going to score 17 points? haha...OK" - Tom Brady
by BlueMark1821 on Nov 2, 2009 11:14 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
thanks pio, did he reaggravate his injury yesterday?
by colts78 on Nov 2, 2009 11:18 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
hope not
can’t really tell. I’ve been searching for some info about it but can’t really find anything yet.
"We’re only going to score 17 points? haha...OK" - Tom Brady
by BlueMark1821 on Nov 2, 2009 11:43 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
How is that different than players committing penalties?
I’m not talking about dirty plays but rather when a cornerback knows the receiver has him beat so he grabs him to prevent a touchdown, or when a lineman is out of position and commits holding to prevent his QB from getting whacked. Those plays aren’t accidents, they’re done on purpose to prevent something worse, or to get out of a mistake they made earlier. By your definition that’s cheating. The team takes the penalty and the game goes on.
In this case the referee stops the play, according to the rules, and the player has to sit out. He comes back in according to the rules.
Keep the faith!
by Marima on Nov 2, 2009 10:57 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
under a catch all definition
Yeah, all incidents you listed are cheating, technically, but its part of the game. I would say this faking injury thing is cheating as well but it also falls under the category of “bush league.” Like A-Rod yelling I got it while rounding the bases on a pop up or Flozell Adams blatantly tripping anyone who gets by him, its frowned upon. I’ll just go with bush league.
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 2, 2009 11:20 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Since when did an injury lose you yards?
There are multiple ways to slow down a Hurry Up offense and substitute players.
One is to call a timeout. That’s why they give you 3 in a half.
Second would be to jump offsides, hitting an offensive lineman, blowing the play dead before it starts. You lose 5 yards in this situation.
Third is to fake an injury. The only “penalty” is you have to sit out one play. As you can tell, it is not even remotely close to the same consequences as the other options, so it is vastly different than a penalty.
Maybe a rule should be in place that if an injury happens, you are not allowed to substitute any players, except the injured guy, unless you use a timeout. And tough shit for the legitimate injuries. If teams didn’t fake injuries, it wouldn’t come to this point.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 11:28 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If teams do it enough, especially against the Colts -
who actually have a “hurry-up offense” and know how to use it – I’m sure the GM will suggest it to the competition committee to have the rule changed. But as it stands there is no proof of a faked injury, the niners took their ‘penalty’ and sat the guy out – according to the rules. The Colts took it for what it was and went on to win the game in spite of it.
The game was a lot closer than I ever figured it would be (I’m only guessing but was Manning ill??? He didn’t look his usual precision self out there.) How many games has that hurry-up offense won for you? Surprisingly, there are so many teams that can’t do it, whether it’s coaching, player personnel, or lack of emphasis. All they know is that they have to stop it to have any chance at all.
Keep the faith!
by Marima on Nov 2, 2009 11:46 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
As I pointed out
There are legitimate ways to slow it down.
When teams don’t use those legitimate ways to slow it down, it should be penalized further.
And creation is different than enforcement.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 11:56 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
"should be" is not an NFL reality
Just because you think a play or player “should be” penalized further if it’s proven that he faked an injury, doesn’t mean it’s cheating when he isn’t and the rules – as currently in place – were followed.
Keep the faith!
by Marima on Nov 2, 2009 11:59 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Teams that deliberately do this
Are bush league and should be called out on it. It’s an obvious flaw in the league, and the fact that it is there to be exploited doesn’t mean it should be.
If “everyone is doing it” (not your words, but others have said it), then the league should look into curtailing it. Just because the league doesn’t punish it as harshly as it should doesn’t make it ok.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 12:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
agreed
but maybe ‘cheating’ isn’t the right word then.
Keep the faith!
by Marima on Nov 2, 2009 12:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
What is?
When you violate NFL rules and undermine the integrity of the game, what “term” is that correctly labeled as for you?
Also, everyone is most certainly not doing what SF did last Sunday and what the Patriots are known for. Most teams play by the rules. Most teams don’t fake injuries. Most teams don’t cheat. We watched six other teams play this Colts offense this year, and I don’t recall one of them using this ugly, Belichick-like tactic. They have pride and integrity. Singletary and Belichick don’t. They are the exception. Not the rule.
SB Nation's Indianapolis Colts blogger at Stampede Blue. Please make an account so you can post a FanPost, make a FanShot, add some comments, and make some noise. Accounts are free, and only require an email address.
by BigBlueShoe on Nov 2, 2009 12:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
What rule was violated?
And please admit that you can’t prove any of your accusations, even against Belichick. It’s flat-out wrong of you to assert that he ever ordered any of his players to go down with a fake injury, just like you have no proof that Singletary did.
This is the only site that has ever accused him of it (BB). Do you really think it’s because you’re the only one who isn’t a coward??? Or maybe, just maybe, you might be making something out of nothing.
Keep the faith!
by Marima on Nov 2, 2009 12:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
But if he did do it
You’d be ok with it?
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 12:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Regardless of BB's reputation on this particular site
faking injuries has never been an issue against him. And the fact that we’re both thinking of the SAME play (singular) pretty much proves it. If the only way Belichick could stop the Colts was to signal a player to fake an injury, in all of the intense games they’ve played against each other, I’m guessing it would have come out before and since that particular game.
So, no, if it happened against the Patriots I’d think it was cheesy. I frankly wouldn’t think to call it cheating… just cheesy.
Keep the faith!
by Marima on Nov 2, 2009 12:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Once is one time too many in my book
It would only be “cheesy” until it cost you a game.
If the Colts pulled this crap, I’d be similarly pissed off at them. As I’ve said, there are legitimate ways to accomplish the same result.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 12:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
But you don't know... you're just assuming
you’ve all chosen to find him guilty of ordering McGinest to go down. McGinest couldn’t have thought to go down on his own, and he never could have really needed to go to the sideline. It was all part of the plan. Nice of Manning to cooperate and wait for him to get back out there so he could make that key stop on the goal line stance. See how ridiculous that sounds?
Keep the faith!
by Marima on Nov 2, 2009 12:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That's not entirely true
We are accusing McGinest of faking an injury, which, if you look at the evidence of him sprinting like a little kid up and down the field after 4th down with his:
McGinest – Knee injury
Belichick – Cramp
It sure doesn’t look like he’s favoring anything. They also didn’t have their story straight of how he was injured.
Belichick gets thrown in there because he’s responsible for everything that goes on on the field. That’s the job of the head coach.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 1:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe there was no story to get straight
BB never says anything about a player injury after a game. He always says they’ll look at it and assess it (whatever it was.)
And maybe you personally are accusing McGinest of faking an injury, but BBS – who doesn’t need anyone to be his apologist – is indeed accusing Belichick.
McGinest denied that he faked anything, ""My leg got caught in the turf," McGinest said. “I would never fake an injury to come off the field and miss a couple of plays. Not during a game like that.”
If you’re concerned about things not being “entirely true” then re-read BBS’s post. Just because something “looks like it” to him, doesn’t mean that it’s the God’s honest truth.
Keep the faith!
by Marima on Nov 2, 2009 2:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
But he did say something
“He cramped up there at the end and couldn’t get off the field,” said Patriots coach Bill Belichick, unaware that McGinest would tell a different tale, that the defender’s knee got caught in the AstroTurf.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 3:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Puh-leeze - the analysis is from the Indy Star
Like I said, BB didn’t know and took a guess. Just a comment taken right after the game, not the next day during the regular press conference where he would have had a chance to review the film and talk with his players. He’s not an idiot.
Keep the faith!
by Marima on Nov 2, 2009 3:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If he didn't know
He should have said as much. Like you said, he’s not an idiot. But he sure looked like it with that quote.
And what does the Indy Star have to do with this? Isn’t it true he said something different than McGinest?
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 3:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
no... just how they couched it
“Belichick, unaware that McGinest would tell a different tale…”
If he’s just saying what he thought happened, and not trying to cover anything up, there’s no need to get a story straight – he was just mistaken in his assumption. It happens sometimes, believe it or not. Sometimes, unlike BBS, what we think we see isn’t what really happened.
It’s why instant replay exists, it’s why coaches throw challenge flags, it’s why eyewitnesses in court can usually be found to contradict what happened even though they were both present.
Keep the faith!
by Marima on Nov 2, 2009 3:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It leaves the door wide open though
Even if everything you said is true, and it’s clearly plausible, he set himself up for it by speculating, rather than either talking to McGinest himself, or just saying he didn’t know.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 3:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
in all seriousness
isnt it possible for a player to fake an injury to stem momentum without their coach ordering it? Willie had been around a long time by 03, I think he could have made the decision on his own. I’m not saying he did. Or that he faked an injury, but I don’t think its a stretch to say its possible that if a player were to fake injuries, it could be done without hte knowledge of the HC>
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 3:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
good points
Isnt it possible for a player to fake an injury to stem momentum without their coach ordering it?
this is highly possible. Who is to say Haralson or Spikes didn’t fake an injury on their own accord? Hence, some of the backlash at BBS for posting such unkind words about Coach Sing when he has absolutely ZERO proof that Sing ordered them to flop. (a Colts Radio Announcer saying he saw signals is NOT proof.) A Radio Announcer doesn’t know what Sing’s hand signals mean, he uses hand signals for the Defense all of the time. It’s understandable to be pissed off and annoyed by teams using the tactic, and I am certainly not proud of my team for doing so if they were, but it happens and there’s not much anyone can do about it until there is some kind of rule to stop it.
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 2, 2009 3:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Of course it's possible
Keep the faith!
by Marima on Nov 2, 2009 3:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
But you know what...
I really can’t recall it happening all that much, where Brady would run a no-huddle and an opposing player would go down and I’d be thinking that the guy is faking. Does it really happen that frequently against the Colts?
Keep the faith!
by Marima on Nov 2, 2009 12:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yes, it happens constantly
and its really quite irritating. The most obvious cases are when the Colts have been slowed by the defense all game, the Colts finally find something that works (for example, the defense will have a dime package on the field) Peyton recognizes the mismatch and they go into their attack mode, and if it gets past 2 positive plays, they got the snap off before the gun shots were fired.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 3:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The Sparkle Kitties
Dusted off the ol’ fake cramp in the first game this year…once by Quentin Groves and once by Derek Landri.
by indy15 on Nov 2, 2009 12:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
"faking injuries"
is a very tricky thing. As I stated earlier, part of using the no-huddle offense is to wear down defenders. This will OFTEN show up in the forms of cramps. The thing is, the league is going to put safety above EVERYTHING. Just like with all the crap calls against defenders for roughing the passer. If those were indeed fakes by SF, they were darn good ones. From what I saw, those guys had to be stretched out on the field by the staff before they got up. Now if a guy went down “cramping” and jumped up once the whistle was blown, I can understand the concern. These guys toppled over grabbing their calf and needed assistance from the training staff. The only ones who will EVER know if they were legitimate cramps or not are the individual players themselves. To call these people out when they very well could have been injured is rediculous.
This is one thing I cannot stand from Colts fans. Seeing a defender fall over due to a cramp should be seen as the offensive scheme working the way it is intended. Instead, players who are injured for our enjoyment are booed. And yes, it will ALWAYS appear to come at critical points in the game. Why? Because it’s the wear of the entire game that becomes an issue.
by Evanbio on Nov 2, 2009 12:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
thats pretty naive of you
if someone is going to fake an injury of course the training staff is going to “stretch them out.” Do you think that they are that dumb that someone is going to fake an injury and then as soon as the clock is stopped get up and be fine?
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 2, 2009 12:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
All I'm saying is....
that the cramps, to me, looked legitimate. Obviously everyone has an opinion on this. Yes, if it’s a fake I do expect the trainers to stretch the players out. But the way the trainers reacted seemed very real to me. So I guess what I’m saying is that if these were fake, the trainers deserve an Oscar for their part in it as well.
As far as mgrex’s suggestion, I actually have no problem with the “only substitute the injured player” rule. With one other aspect to note. During an injury, sometimes the offense will also change their play call/personell. Especially in a no-huddle situation. Just like in this game, if the offense changes personell, the D gets an opportunity to change personell as well. So if the rule states that either the O and D have to keep same personell sans injured player, or gives the D an opportunity to match a change in the O personell, then I think it’s a great rule. I do not think you can carry the rule over for the entire series however.
by Evanbio on Nov 2, 2009 12:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Then the league should take my suggestion to heart
If a player gets hurt, the only player that is allowed to be substituted is the injured player for that next play. That way only the injured will actually go down with an injury.
It’s an easy solution. If they want to substitute more players, take a timeout, or take a 5 yard penalty.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 12:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
even better would be
a rule where if a player goes out due to injury or “injury”, they cannot come back in until the next series. That would solve this problem very efficiently.
by coltus on Nov 2, 2009 12:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'd shy away from that one
Players fake an injury to get substitutes on the field. If they aren’t allowed to substitute, it will stop the fake ones from happening.
It’s a lot like when a hockey team gets called for icing, they cannot substitute lines. In fact, it’s almost identical.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 12:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
it's fine to keep your idea of
ONLY substituting for that player, but adding that that player also may not re-enter the game until the next series is the kicker. For example, in 03 Willie McGinnist would never have been in on that last play because he had gone out with “injury” two plays before. (or the alternative, play would never have been stopped by a fourth TO for faking injury becuase McGinnist would want to remain in the game so he never would have taken a dive)
by coltus on Nov 2, 2009 12:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
the problem here is.....
how do you distinguish the faked injury from a real one? that’s the main issue in “punishment” for this. if you say anytime a player is injured he has to miss an entire series, you’ll have a lot more serious injuries as players stay in and aggravate something minor. So if Manning smacks his throwing hand on a helmet during a followthrough, and he needs to get it taped up/looked at, you want to keep him on the sideline for the rest of the series?
by Evanbio on Nov 2, 2009 1:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
if they can make it off the field on their own power
then they obviously aren’t faking it because there would be no benefit of doing so. If Manning has to tape his hand up come off the field tape it go back in. If you have a cramp and someone has to come get you off the field, you’re done for the drive.
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 2, 2009 4:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I hate...
agreeing with a pats fan.
by WaynesWorld on Nov 3, 2009 10:48 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Hayden
any word on how long he is out for?
by dkloster3 on Nov 2, 2009 11:19 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Completely unnecessary article.
1) two people saying it is true, does not make it true. For example, more than two people have accused us of piping in noise.
2) if they did cheat so what? Is that really the best / most interesting aspect of the game?
3) we are better then this. We are classy. Classy people don’t call other people idiots for disagreeing, classy people don’t gleefully trash other people for their own petty faults.
I think BBS, if you asked tony dungy, how he would react to this, he would say "it was unfortunate, that’s not the way the game should be played, but everyone makes mistakes.
He would not say: “and yes, Mike Singletary is indeed still a bum. Go Colts!”
Even if Mike Singletary is a bum, that does not mean that you should write a whole article centering on that point. I am disappointed because I love this blog because it goes past the sensational crap (who is TO dating now), this obsession with a minor thing is beneath you as a writer.
by sandsnake on Nov 2, 2009 11:27 AM EST reply actions 7 recs
+1 and rec'd
This post proved nothing at all really, except that BBS is being ridiculous.
by yellowsnow on Nov 2, 2009 12:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
even if you are to right an article on it dont write three there is a point where you must jut move on
there are other aspects of this game we should be looking at like our line which struggled
GO COLTS!!! 09 IS OURS!!!
by TheAngelsColts on Nov 2, 2009 4:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Come on guys...
I’ve been a long time reader here at Stampede Blue and def a BBS fan. The guy obviously loves football and esp loves the Colts. I can’t blame him for wanting a clean, honest match-up between the two teams yesterday. If you don’t like what he wrote, state your case but let’s leave the personal attacks out of here. I even saw someone wrote that he banged another guy’s wife. What’s next? Mom jokes? "Ed Johnson’s mom is so fat…blah blah blah"
This is a football blog. Let’s keep it at that. Unless Belichick is willing to let us see the sideline video from yesterday, we can’t be sure what happened. The whole thing seemed sketchy. Spikes was even booed by the crowd as he limped off the field. He has to live with that now.
Anyone else think the cure for our rhythm problem would be the return of the BRILLIANT route-running of Mr. Anthony Gonzalez? And props to Bobby on his INT. I loved it.
by dRUMATiC on Nov 2, 2009 11:34 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
True
I’m looking forward to Gonzo’s return. Specially since there have been several dropped passes and that Garcon is not playing that good.
Any word on when he could return to practice?
P.S. Bobzilla rocks
"We’re only going to score 17 points? haha...OK" - Tom Brady
by BlueMark1821 on Nov 2, 2009 11:40 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm looking forward
to Gonzo’s return. Since there have been some dropped passes and considering Garcon hasn’t been playing that good (not that his bad or something), I do think Gonzo’s return is what we need. It would be a BIG improvement to this already great offense
"We’re only going to score 17 points? haha...OK" - Tom Brady
by BlueMark1821 on Nov 2, 2009 11:46 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This is my first opinion on this matter
I have read almost all the comments on the other threads including over at ninersnation on the subject of the fakes injuries and this is my opinion on it.
I hated it when it happened so i do believe they faked it and we all know that manning works like a precision clock he needs play after play to get the defense to where he wants them for the big play, one way to to beat him is to disrupt the sequence. But faking an injury is a low and classless to achieve that the good teams would either take the big play or pay with a time out to stop it.
But even that im on the “they cheated” boat, i think the biggest controversy here is how BBS have expressed it, i have to admit i was a lil bit shocked as i read words like “BUM” and “VOMIT” and statements like “if you dont like it, just leave”.
Kevin Lynch is on the same boat i am but he expressed it with words like “might have faked it” and did not name called anyone.
I believe that we have built a decent reputation as fans around the interwebs and that is difficult to get but easy to loose.
And the biggest thing is that the fact that matter , the whole point on the dispute gets displaced and second to the way it was presented on this blog.
BBS i enjoy your blog posts a lot, you are one hell of a blogger and writer and a pretty good broadcaster also, but this time i felt it so out of character i thought your account was hacked :) , it felt like this:

We all love Colts football … GO COLTS!!
by thebossuzzi on Nov 2, 2009 11:44 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
aaaa
cant see the picture :(
"We’re only going to score 17 points? haha...OK" - Tom Brady
by BlueMark1821 on Nov 2, 2009 11:47 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
cheating as a way of life....
None of this surprises me. In a world and country where “wrong” is right and “right” is wrong, the stunts pulled by the 49’rs represent conditions of a foul cesspool of a city, and, a state where all of “what’s wrong with the world” is embraced with wide open arms! Those of us whom study the daily decline of civilization take a break with a bit of sports only to find “the game” coated in the same slime that coats education, politics (especially now), faith, science, and business. Is there no hope for dignity, integrity, or morality? Of course not in the hell-hole of San Francisco, but, perhaps, in a locker room in Indianapolis, there are a few men with the guts to stand up and be counted. Tony Dungy used his strong faith and morality to instill and ethic into the staff and team in blue and white. His replacement appears to be a man of courage and honor. Let us hope he continues leading the Colts away from the cliff’s edge of Belichickian madness.
by bhartbleedsblue on Nov 2, 2009 11:57 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Spinning the wheel of morality?
“49’rs represent conditions of a foul cesspool of a city, and, a state where all of "what’s wrong with the world" is embraced with wide open arms!”
I guess you are one of the ones who would cast the first stone. Remember its only a football game! You need to get out of this weird world you live in. Last time I checked, Indie was not Gods chosen city! Immorality and so called cesspools exist everywhere in this world. You might notice this if you journeyed beyond Middle Earth and got out of your Hobbit home. You assume too much of the Colts staff and players. Just because Dungy was a man of faith,it does not by any means make the rest of the staff and team the same way. If you deny that,then there are obviously some issues you need to work out in your life. Maybe the voices in your head can help you solve them.
by DrAquafresh on Nov 2, 2009 1:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Wheel of morality?
You mean this, right?
Now a proud annoyance on Stampede Blue, 18to88, Indy Football Report, and Phil B's blog.
Man, I need a life...
Random fact of the week from the empty void that is my mind: Viz Media (The creators of my absolute favorite show of all-time and inspiration to my avatar, Naruto) just announced a partnership with the channel Disney XD to bring the English-dubbed episodes of Naruto Shippuden (The continuation of the Naruto series) to that station with a new episode airing each week, starting, well, NOW. With the series recording I just put on it, this is one of the greatest days I've had in a long time. I'm not kidding. I love the show that much.
by Cassieper on Nov 2, 2009 6:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I wuv you.
Man, I miss that show.
by vintagephoenix on Nov 2, 2009 6:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Me too.........
Now a proud annoyance on Stampede Blue, 18to88, Indy Football Report, and Phil B's blog.
Man, I need a life...
Random fact of the week from the empty void that is my mind: Viz Media (The creators of my absolute favorite show of all-time and inspiration to my avatar, Naruto) just announced a partnership with the channel Disney XD to bring the English-dubbed episodes of Naruto Shippuden (The continuation of the Naruto series) to that station with a new episode airing each week, starting, well, NOW. With the series recording I just put on it, this is one of the greatest days I've had in a long time. I'm not kidding. I love the show that much.
by Cassieper on Nov 2, 2009 6:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
nothing like some 90's nostalgia
by torontocoltsfan on Nov 2, 2009 7:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I used to be really into nostalgia
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 2, 2009 7:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
lol
you don’t like being nostalgic anymore?
by torontocoltsfan on Nov 2, 2009 7:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You guessed it!
Wow, I didn’t think anyone would know what I was talking about! The wheel is a way of life, butt hat’s just the way I swim in the cesspools of San Francisco.
by DrAquafresh on Nov 2, 2009 8:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Animanics was one of my favorite shows
growing up. It would be hard to sneak a line from that past me.
Now a proud annoyance on Stampede Blue, 18to88, Indy Football Report, and Phil B's blog.
Man, I need a life...
Random fact of the week from the empty void that is my mind: Viz Media (The creators of my absolute favorite show of all-time and inspiration to my avatar, Naruto) just announced a partnership with the channel Disney XD to bring the English-dubbed episodes of Naruto Shippuden (The continuation of the Naruto series) to that station with a new episode airing each week, starting, well, NOW. With the series recording I just put on it, this is one of the greatest days I've had in a long time. I'm not kidding. I love the show that much.
by Cassieper on Nov 2, 2009 9:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'd be careful, there's a no politics rule and you are skirting it
you can have all the political views you want (I myself have plenty) but this is not the place for any of them.
Luck is probability taken personally, clutch is probability attributed to individuals.
by shake n bake on Nov 2, 2009 1:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
oh san francisco is a cesspool alright...
A cesspool of AWESOMENESS!
But seriously, at first I was extremely put off by your holier than thou comments. I’ve lived in San Francisco for the last 7 years and love it. I suppose in your eyes that makes me some kind of sodommite, but I also know most people on this site are smart enough to see you for what you are.
by Fooch on Nov 2, 2009 1:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Sarcasm receptors down?
I realize it’s a bit of a heated thread right now, but this post is quite obviously a joke. Right…..?
by IndyPacers on Nov 2, 2009 3:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Colts cheated by cutting out the 49ers radio in Alex Smith's helmet!
Yes, before half time the Colts cheated. That is why Alex Smith’s headset radio went out before their two minute drill.
How much more EVIDENCE do you have that the 49ers deliberately stole two time outs with fake cramps than I do that the Colts deliberately screwed with the 49ers quartback’s headset just before halftime?
ZERO.
NOT ONE SINGLE SHRED MORE.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 4:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
if you win anyway.....
is it even worth mentioning???
kinda like your lil brother cheating on madden…
and you still win…
then the next day you call him out on it.
You are banned from Music City Miracles. (twice)
You are banned from Blogging The Boys.
by chrisd21 on Nov 2, 2009 12:00 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!
Visit FanIQ.com for sports news, bloggings, polls, and more!
by MrNFL on Nov 2, 2009 12:07 PM EST reply actions 8 recs
red'd, couldn't agree more
this is ridiculous
by foosball4949 on Nov 2, 2009 12:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The other side is..
If we had mentioned this and we has lost the game people would have called us sore losers. Damned if you do….
Guess who my favorite team is...
by Indcolt18 on Nov 2, 2009 12:13 PM EST via mobile reply actions 0 recs
texan fan here
this is hilarious. YOU WON THE FREAKING GAME
good god, its like a group of 14 year old girls fighting over who get the only tampon.
but serioulsy, yall should be more concerned about the texans, who are coming up there to prove they are legit and can hang with ANY team in the league.
(also, yall dont need the win, your allready assured a first round bye)
so let us texan fans have a little fun
kudos to your D carrying my fantasy team, and lucky for yall that THE BEST TE IN THE NFL wont be playing this sunday :-)
by Allen-OU on Nov 2, 2009 12:38 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I am concerned about the Texans
You guys have a good team this year and sunday’s game will be the toughest game of the season for both teams so far.
Owen Daniels injury is just sad man. Saying he is better than Clark is a tragedy.
"We’re only going to score 17 points? haha...OK" - Tom Brady
by BlueMark1821 on Nov 2, 2009 12:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This post is 100% free of class
I have lived in Indiana for 11 years, and it has been my pleasure to watch this Colts team become one of the greats. But unfortunately, it seems the fanbase is trending toward spoiled brat-dom.
Kevin Lynch of the San Francisco Chronicle is one of the single worst columnists covering Bay Area Sports, that’s #1. It seems to be his mission in life to say stupid things that go with the flow, and you just bit on it hook, line and sinker.
Indcolt18 said “if we had lost the game people would have called us sore losers.” Well you sure as hell are sore winners. If you had blown us out you wouldn’t have cared whether those injuries were faked or not.
The FACTS are you don’t know whether a person actually fakes an injury or not. Kevin Lynch, swayed by the boos of 50,000 utterly classless whining fans, posts something that just goes with what you’re thinking, and you run with it.
It’s pathetic. You all are whiners and spoiled. Get over yourselves.
by Indiana Jim on Nov 2, 2009 12:42 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
To be honest I hadn't even heard of Kevin Lynch
before BBS mentioned him.
And his blog for the Chronicle is named “Niner Insider” but that doesn’t mean he’s an actual inside guy for the 49ers. Matt Maiocco is sort of “the guy” that 49ers fans actually turn to for insight or for serious reporting about the inner workings of the 49ers.
by jveezy on Nov 2, 2009 1:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Im simply going to repost what 18to88 said
The dives by the 49ers defenders. That one linebacker saw they couldn’t make their substitutions so he dropped like he was shot. When is the league going fine/penalize teams for this nonsense?
simple, direct, and concise. Lets move on to the Texans
by metal_militia on Nov 2, 2009 12:53 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
ok and what about when Addai
saw he wouldn’t have time to sub out so he suddenly grasped his hand in pain to get off the field. Hypocrite much?
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 2, 2009 2:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
you keep saying this..
I don’t think you understand the crux of the situation.
First, Addai doesn’t fake injuries. He’s just always injured.
Second, the offense gains nothing by having him injured – when they sub, the defense is given, by rule, time to match subs. The Colts didnt use his injury as a free time out, they wanted to go hurry up. They didn’t use his injury to sub. They didn’t do anything of the sort. If anything, Addai’s injury hurt the colts because they had to stop and allow another RB to come on the field. Put your sword down, Don, the windmills are retreating.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 2:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That is absolutely false
And I rewatched it to prove it.
Addai was hurt on a first down play, which was an incomplete pass to Collie, which could have been a fumble, and Addai jumped on the ball.
2nd down was a pass over the middle to Garcon, where Mike Hart (#32) was in the backfield with Manning. Addai was not on the field.
On the 3rd down, which everyone is complaining about, was a pass to Wayne, where the Colts substituted nobody on the play, which is completely legal to run a quick play. Addai was not on the field for 2nd down, so Addai never came out of the game for the 3rd down play.
Maybe you should know the facts before trumpeting false information.
Also, Addai never caused an injury timeout either. Stop using this play.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 2:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i dont think
we’ll be seeing Lou again… Im guessing he/she doesn’t understand what the whole fakin dem dare injurtings is about.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 2:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
lol awesome now I'm a country bumpkin
Colts fans classles and racist WTG
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 2, 2009 2:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
racist?
how is calling you uneducated racist?
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 2:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think, thinking that being uneducated is synonymous with race is racist.
by shep31 on Nov 2, 2009 2:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
your implying i'm some sort of country bumpkin or something
maybe not racist per se, but really you show your lack of class by resorting to personal attacks when I in no way personally attacked either of you.
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 2, 2009 2:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
dont bring me into this, I was just making a statement based on the previous posts. I called you nothing… per se.
by shep31 on Nov 2, 2009 2:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I was just pointing out that I didn't personally attack either of you guys
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 2, 2009 2:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I also attacked no one… we’re a blameless bunch.
by shep31 on Nov 2, 2009 2:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think you show your lack of class and intellect
by shouting RACISM when someone says you’re uneducated. Racism? RACISM? Please, I don’t even know where to begin? Race was never brought into the discussion, and last time i checked, ‘country bumpkins’ (which you inferred, and YOUR words) werent a race.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 2:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
but keep harping on my obvious
racism, and not your lack of common sense. Addai didnt fake an injury because doing so would gain the Colts nothing.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 2:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
lol i'm not harping on anything
honestly I don’t think you’re racist I was just throwing words out there because I felt like I was being attacked personally for no reason. I don’t care if you think I’m unedumacated or not, I know that I am and that’s what matters. I went back to watch the game tape if you read below and admitted my mistake and have realized that I need to go back and re-watch the whole game, because a long night of killing brain cells erased most of my memory of the game.
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 2, 2009 3:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
No one enjoys seeing their organization attacked. The Colts have been accused of pumping in crowd noise and being finesse and soft and trying to trick people (thanks, Joey Porter). It hurts and it makes you defensive. I can honestly say, though, that if the Colts wanted to fake injuries, they would have done so at the end of the 1st half, when they couldnt stop Joe Montana from going 90 yards in 3 plays.
I think its a little unprofessional and careless to blame Singletary. As I said in a post above, they could have faked the cramps without the order coming from the HC. It could have come from the LB coach, or, hey, Takeo Spikes is, what, 50 years old? He knows a lot of tricks.
In my mind, however, its really not a question of whether or not the cramps were faked. There are tell tale signs:
The game will be close. The Colts offense will have struggled for some period of time. Mo’ will have started wearing a horse shoe. Couple of plays that look like the Colts are getting into a Rhythm. Attack mode /on. And then they start, and its usually multiple “injuries” near the LOS. And its never CBs. Its always people that would sub out in different situations. Its usually sub package linemen or LBers.
Sorry for insulting you personally, should have just tried harder to explain the difference in situations to you until we were able to work it out civilly, as you did with mgrex.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 3:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
No problem, sorry for the racist comment as well
and thanks for your very well-reasoned response, I completely understand how frustrating it is for you guys, as you are obviously no stranger to the tactic. I don’t see anything wrong with complaining about it and being pissed off, I know for sure it would bug me if teams did it to us all of the time, I just think blaming Coach Singletary and calling him a bunch of names on MULTIPLE FRONT PAGE posts isn’t the way to go.
I said it earlier I have NO problems with Colts fans, you guys have always been a pretty classy fan base IMO and I’ve always had a great deal of respect for the Manning led Colts. It’s just disappointing that we feel like we pushed your team to the limit and gave them a good fight, only to have your lead guy basically show us no respect and pretty much blame the bad game on the 49ers being cheaters. I’ve lost a lot of respect for BBS, but I definitely won’t hold that against every Colts fans.
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 2, 2009 4:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
One thing that isnt quantifiable
is whether or not (alleged) faking works. I personally don’t think it works too well (2003 excluded). The problem is, when the defense starts the faking, they are telegraphing their intentions: we can’t stop what they are doing. So when they fake and sub, they are subbing to stop whatever the Colts are doing, so the Colts will just do something else. The key to all of this is Dallas Clark. When they are in attack mode, and say the Colts are running the ball on a dime package, the faking starts. Now they go base. Dallas Clark will go from TE to slot, and now he’ll just split the safeties every play until the next injury comes, and then its back to running on your nickel/dime. Would be interesting to go through all the Colts games and see how well the cramps work. There is a sufficient sample size, just watch the Jaguar games, its a Del Rio specialty.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 4:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
LMAO
well guess what, the 49ERS RADIO ANNOUNCER said he was faking so it’s absolutely true.
Maybe you should know the facts before trumpeting false information.
oh really? and it’s a fact that Takeo Spikes wasn’t really injured. Ok smart guy, prove it. Please prove to me that Takeo Spikes was faking his injury.
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 2, 2009 2:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Lou
THE OFFENSE GAINS NOTHING FROM FAKING AN INJURY. They don’t get a free time out and they are the ones that dictate substitution rotation. You don’t have to agree with BBS, but you do have to be able to exercise some common sense, and at this time you are showing an inability to do so. Faking an offensive injury does NOTHING for the offense. Nothing. NNNOOOOOOOOOTHHHHINGGGGG….
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 2:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You don't get it
And you never will.
Why the hell would Addai need to fake an injury in that situation? Please explain to me why. I’m waiting on pins and needles.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 2:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
No I get it fine
I went back to re-watch the play in question. Addai left the field and the official incorrectly began to run the clock without giving our Defense a chance to sub. I’ll admit my mistake, Addai leaving the field had nothing to do with what happened, he was just coincidentally the guy leaving the field at the time. I understand that the offense benefits in no way from faking an injury, just sometimes you see things differently in the heat of the moment.
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 2, 2009 3:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You still don't get it
The injury occurred on 1st down, and he walked off the field after 1st down, without the clock stopping before 2nd down. The 49ers were most definitely given the right to substitute after 1st down.
They were not given the right to substitute after 2nd down, when the Colts did not substitute anyone. The Colts, or Addai, did absolutely nothing wrong.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 3:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
ok
I don’t think Addai or the Colts did anything wrong, I admit I was incorrect in thinking Addai faking an injury caused us to not be able to sub in. I believe I need to go back and re-watch the entire game again as a lot of my memory was washed away by my good friend Jack Daniels last night.
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 2, 2009 3:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Fair Enough
The play(s) in question happened with ~3 minutes to go in the 3rd quarter, so you can see for yourself when Addai comes out of the game.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 3:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah and I believe I was watching a completely different point of the game
a few minutes ago. I will have to watch the whole game again and see if I can find where I believe the official didn’t allow us time to sub or if it was just my mind playing tricks.
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 2, 2009 3:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The only time I remember
Would have been on the 2 pt conversion, where the refs stepped in and said the Colts needed to allow substitutions.
If the Colts didn’t try to substitute anyone on that play, however, the refs were wrong in stopping it.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 3:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I hope the Texans trounce you...
…and fake 35 injuries just to make you mad.
by Indiana Jim on Nov 2, 2009 1:05 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
this year
owen daniels has been better, and throw in the fact that the BEST PLAYER ON EARTH is throwing clark the ball.
they are at least equal, but clark has done it more consistently and for longer.
you cant say that it would be a travesty to say owen is better, but you must admit this year he has been as good as clark, and has 50 or so less rec yards, and 2 more TD’s. they are clearly the top 3 with gates
by Allen-OU on Nov 2, 2009 1:10 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
It is sad for a player to end the season with an injury
I dont like injuries , not even injuries to colts rivals, OD was having a hell of a year and is sad for the sport to loose any good player, NFL have many bad players. D. Clark is also having a hell of a year and i would cry if he gets a season ending injury. So my good wishes for his recovery and i mean this from heart, i know many fans pray for injuries so their team can win it easy but i personally there is something better than winning and it is being the best and you can only be the best if you win to teams thats close or at full strength , Not that OD injury makes the texans worse in fact they dont need him to make a stand they have plenty of good players but my prayers are with OD as a player and a person.
by thebossuzzi on Nov 2, 2009 1:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You are aware that your Texans have played one more game than the Colts, right?
Dallas Clark(TE IND) 7th in NFL receiving, 46(REC)- 57(TAR)(81%), 584(YDS), 12.7(AVG), 3TD, 80(LONG), 7(20+), 83.4(YPG), 1(FUM), 240(YAC), 21(1stDWN) in 7 games.
Owen Daniels(TE HOU) 13th in NFL receiving, 40(REC)- 57(TAR)(70%) , 519(YDS), 13.0(AVG), 5(TD), 44(LONG), 8(20+), 64.9(YPG), 1(FUM), 219(YAC), 28(1st DWN) in 8 games.
Nice try.
by HoosierHorseman on Nov 2, 2009 1:32 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
That stat of 240 YAC for Dallas in one less game to 219 YAC for Daniels
kind of eliminates the Peyton factor, besides Shaub’s pretty good himself.
And you have to give Dallas credit for doing this year after year.
by HoosierHorseman on Nov 2, 2009 1:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
throwing stones
im not here to say they were or were not faking. but the second instance with takeo spikes looked real. his biceps were flexed his face was grimacing. not fake. i love my colts radio crew-bob is awesome-but i have a better view in high definition sitting on my couch than they do up in the press box. we won be happy and quit whining about a player with a cramp. if they faked it then oh well. not one fan in that stadium can definetively say they were faking it. personally i was disappointed with our home crowd for booing someone that may have really been in pain (which their facial expressions seemed to suggest they were). im more concerned with the lack of class by our fans than i am with whether or not singletary is related to beli-cheat.
by drummerboy on Nov 2, 2009 1:55 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Finally Found a Writer with the Guts to Tell the Truth - Go Blue!
Blue thank you for saying what all of us know is the truth. We are collectively hurting the moral fabric of soceity when we communicate “It’s only cheating if you can prove it in court or you are caught red-handed”. There actually is a thing called winning and losing with honor and it is important to correctly identify such to the community at large and to our children!
by PiusVeritas on Nov 2, 2009 2:01 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
lol wow BBS you are a sad individual. still bitching about this shit?
your fucking team won GET THE FUCK OVER IT YOU CRYBABY
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 2, 2009 2:05 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
BBS You are a advertising and publicity genius
There’s a reason this once small humble Colts site has become one of the biggest sports blogs on the internet. Keep making them talk Big Blue!
by LBizZLE on Nov 2, 2009 2:13 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
morons
first of all everyone knows that the cess-pool of all things immoral resides in massachusetts. and second of all if you come on here to complain about the moral fabric of our society then youre preaching to the wrong congregation. this is a colts forum not a push your pesimistic views of our country down peoples throats forum. keep your religious and social views to yourself. you dont like our society—get out from behind the computer and go out into the world to change it. or shut up. thank you to our defense for another stellar game. thank you joseph for making the ugliest td pass of the season. and special thanks to matt “strange stance” stover and pat “hunter who” mcfee for leading an excellent special teams corp on sunday—go colts
by drummerboy on Nov 2, 2009 2:16 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
If you aren’t cheating you aren’t trying.
IMO, if the need were there I would hope that the Colts would do this exactly. You win games however you can, and this ‘cheating’ is an example. It is an unprovable and perfect cheat. Exactly the kind that should be implemented. I applaud them for using these tactics. I’m no boyscout and I try to keep a realistic world view and cheating happens, every game, every team. So good for the 9ers cant blame em a bit.
Long story short we still won. It didn’t matter one bit.
by shep31 on Nov 2, 2009 2:39 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
the colts dont have a need to fake injuries
they get injured enough on their own.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 2:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
How many times did it happen ?
If the refs let them get away with it, shouldn’t they shoulder the blame as well ?
You are banned from Music City Miracles.
Happy Now Tits?
You are banned from Blogging The Boys.
by CFHTim on Nov 2, 2009 2:46 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
"It's Unprovable"
Exactly. Just like it’s unprovable that the Colts deliberately interfered with the 49ers QB radio.
Which means this entire argument is useless, except for giving people something to talk about.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 5:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Careful, BBS
Between this post and your “make no mistakes” post about Peyton calling out Tom Brady, I’m afraid you’re becoming Mike Florio.
by hoosierdore on Nov 2, 2009 3:06 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
maybe BBS is tryin
to get a CBS or Fox gig like Florio has with NBC… its the tried and true rule: if someone else gets famous by screaming nonsense at the top of their lungs, go with it.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 3:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Didn't there used to be a rule
that when a player injury resulted in the stoppage of time the player’s team would be charged a time out? If so when did they do away with this?
by Nole Holds Barred on Nov 2, 2009 3:56 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I believe that rule is only in effect
in the last 2 minutes of the 2nd and 4th quarters.
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 2, 2009 4:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i think you are right
how come no one cramps then?
listen this is an old tactic to stop the no-huddle momentum a loophole in the rule book, but not everyone use it as it is in fact not a clean tactic.
i hate when teams do that it hurts and no time out is lost , hard to prove but we know better dont we? we are not idiots.
by thebossuzzi on Nov 2, 2009 4:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
“hard to prove but we know better, don’t we?”
No, we don’t. No more then we know that the Colts deliberately screwed with the 49ers quarterback radio just before the two minute drill they ran.
We saw the 49ers have cramps on two plays out of how many the Colts ran in the no huddle? The percentage of no huddle plays the 49ers players had cramps must have been less than 10%. Perhaps someone will actually tally the number, but it was a small percentage, which means that it is just as likely nothing but coincidence. Meanwhile, the percentage of plays the 49ers quarterback radio was out during their two minute drill was 100%. I would say that the latter is more fishy.
Yet because people see what they want to see rather than what the evidence dictates, you have all been convinced that the 49ers cheated. It is obvious why: you are so egotistical that you can’t fathom the 49ers not getting blown out without cheating. Pathetic.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 5:05 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Must have been an interesting game.
You are banned from Music City Miracles.
Happy Now Tits?
You are banned from Blogging The Boys.
by CFHTim on Nov 2, 2009 5:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Don’t get involved, just move along. Let the Colts and Niners fans have their hissy fits.
by nolander on Nov 2, 2009 5:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Stay on Topic Nolander
Don’t want to see the banhammer today.
You are banned from Music City Miracles.
Happy Now Tits?
You are banned from Blogging The Boys.
by CFHTim on Nov 2, 2009 5:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It was a pretty entertaining one.
It just goes to show how great Peyton Manning is. Even though the 49ers gave him difficulty all game, he never turned it over, and when the game was on the line he got several crucial 3rd down conversions in a row. The guy is tops.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 5:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He's Great
I would pick Brady over him personally, but they are the best in the league.
You are banned from Music City Miracles.
Happy Now Tits?
You are banned from Blogging The Boys.
by CFHTim on Nov 2, 2009 5:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think Manning
has done more with less.
Brady’s first super bowls were won by the defense.
The only time he was THE reason was the 07 season, and we all saw what happened there.
Manning > Brady > possibly than any QB ever.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 6:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I like you
:-)
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 2, 2009 6:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
hey man I was just answering the guys question
wasn’t implying anything with it. Those are the actual rules.
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 2, 2009 10:06 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Huh... cheating...
Is this the same Colt team who coincidentally alegedly had artificial crowd noise from the speakers?
Is this the same one in which ALEX SMITH’S headset “coincidentally” went out at the start of their two minute drill just before half time?
Look, you can’t prove a d*mn thing. Sure, MAYBE they got themselves free timeouts. MAYBE. But, unfortunately for you, there isn’t a shred of evidence that this conspiracy theory is true. Not one single shred. All you have is a possible motive. Nothing else. No EVIDENCE at all. You have no more evidence that the 49ers were getting free time outs by faking cramps than I do that the Colts deliberately screwed up the 49ers helmet radio in quarterback Alex Smith’s helmet just before their 2 minute drill.
Thus, you fail.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 4:55 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
well
you should cut his headset off more often, since that was the best he looked all game. you’re welcome for the help.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 5:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
hahahahahaha!!! touche!
That is clever, however it doesn’t change the fact that his headset “mysteriously” cut out just before the 49ers needed to run a two minute drill.
Either case of alleged cheating is just as provable as the other.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 5:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
nope, i admit it, we cheated
there ya go. the reason you lost was because we cheated.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 5:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The outcome of...
an action does not justify it.
We lost that game because the Colts defense played lights out in the second half and the 49ers coaching staff clammed up with a small lead- a completely foolish move against an offense quarterbacked by Peyton Manning.
The fact still remains that there is just as much evidence that the 49ers cheated by faking cramps as there is that the Colts cheated by causing Alex Smith’s radio headset to “mysteriously” cut out at the most crucial point of the half. ZERO.
Sometimes when you try to cheat it backfires, so IF the Colts did this deliberately, oops…
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 5:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
im not justifying it
we cheated. sorry. i would forfeit if i could. I don’t need any proof. the headset went out. we cheated. we’re cheaters. you guys are the best defense ive seen all year. you’re stacked on dl and lb and your dbs are great at playing disciplined football. you’re going to make the playoffs and i think you have a chance at beating the vikings in the nfccg and making the super bowl. if you meet the colts, you’ll probably beat them the second time around, because we won’t be able to cheat you on a neutral field. its only a moral victory, but know that you would have won without our cheating and go on to a 12-4 season. god speed.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 5:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
SpazMo, stop being so hard...
on yourself lol. Or, stop being a humorous troll, whichever the case may be.
Some people are very serious about this, and some of us are here simply because we are bored.
No, we probably won’t make the playoffs, but we aren’t a bad team. You guys, however, will probably win the Super Bowl, and please do! I’d much rather see you guys do it than the Patriots or worse yet, the Steelers. I will be rooting for the Colts the rest of the year (as soon as they get a loss or two, that is :D- can’t have people saying your team is better than the 89 or 84 niners, now can we)…
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 6:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If the Colts do win the Super Bowl
can’t have people saying your team is better than the 89 or 84 niners, now can we)…
And the comparisons are justified, I’ll look into that comparison. Being a Notre Dame Alum, there is a special place in my heart for Joe Montana.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 6:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well...
the ‘84 team finished 3 points from 18-0 and the 14-2 ’89 team had the greatest margin of victory in the playoffs in NFL history, so I wouldn’t say that a comparison between the 09 Colts and 89 niners is justified just yet.
But Manning and Montana? Certainly. Manning has made a strong case for the title Best Ever. No doubt.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 6:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think it's justified yet either
If it is, I’ll compare them. But definitely not yet.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 6:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
CBS took full blame and responsibility for the feedback problems
(for anyone who can read) in the national news 2 days after that game.
Christ, is that bullshit gonna live forever?
The only people still buying that are the ones who just WANT it to be true.
I kept the article bookmarked for like three years, I didn’t think I needed it any more.
by HoosierHorseman on Nov 2, 2009 7:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Never let reality get in the way of a good story.
Don’t feed trolls. Make fun of them.
by vintagephoenix on Nov 2, 2009 7:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You have a source for that?
That’s the first I’ve heard that happening.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 5:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah...
Just to to the 49ers website and watch the coach pressers. 49ers headset went out on (I believe) several occasions during the game.
Yet, mysteriously, the Colts did not…
No, I am not accusing the Colts of cheating. I am chalking it up to coincidence. I only make the point because so many people are believing something on INTUITION instead of EVIDENCE.
I would imagine that these are the very same people who believe the world was created during the Bronze age.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 5:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If they told the officials
They should have taken away the Colts headset privileges on defense as well. They’ve done it in the past.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 5:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Honestly, folks. That’s now two separate sources, both covering two different sides of the game (one the Colts announcers, the other a writer for the SF Chronicle) who saw the same thing: Cheating. If you need more proof than that, then I don’t know what to tell you. Maybe you think the Earth is flat as well.
You can’t honestly be serious. Because three people thought the Niners faked injuries, that must be so. And anyone who disagrees with you is akin to denying the Earth is round. This is a laughable proposal.
And what if the Niners did cheat? Can we be sure, no. So notice how no other “source” belittled the Niners coach so much without definite proof. That is what is angering Niners fans so much, not the fact that you say they cheated. How do you know Singletary even called for that? It couldn’t have been a defensive coach or one of the players doing it on their own? You have no idea, but you’ve ridiculed a coach repeatedly anyway. For two plays. What your doing is embarassing for yourself and Colts fans, it’s said that you don’t see it.
by Brendan Scolari on Nov 2, 2009 5:29 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Yes, you are correct.
But some people simply do not live their lives with the higher intellectual standards that other do.
And you are right, it is NOT an equivalent thing to claim that the Earth is flat. In fact it is terribly poor reasoning to make such an assessment, which only shows you what we are dealing with here…
While though difficult, it is possible to prove beyond all reasonable doubt that the Earth is not flat simply using trigonometry and astronomy.
Conversely, it is patently IMPOSSIBLE to prove beyond all reasonable doubt that the 49ers had two instances of fake cramps. Not to mention that as a football player, it is guaranteed that they were a bit banged up anyway, so it couldn’t POSSIBLY be cheating anyway, since the players HAD to be at least a little bit “injured.” Last I checked, there isn’t an official definition of what constitutes an injury in the first place.
This entire article and subsequent defense by Colts fans is laughable and pathetic.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 5:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I just chuckled
Guy named “Cartesian” talking about the Earth being flat.
How about this suggestion for a rule change…If a player is injured, the rules for substitution should remain the same. That is, if the offense doesn’t substitute, than the defense can’t as well for the next play. If the offense decides to substitute, the defense may do so as well. This is in addition to the current rule that the injured player must come out for the next play.
It becomes very fishy when the Colts are lining up to snap the ball, then all of a sudden a player goes down with a cramp. I realize that a cramp can come at any time, but you can’t deny it is fishy and can lead to these accusations. We’ve seen the same situation play out many times, so it makes it less and less of a coincidence to us.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 5:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
lol yes, but we don't live in a Carteisan universe...
… heck, we don’t even live in a Minkowski space universe, except in the absence of gravitational fields and over small space-time intervals…
Now, as far as your “fishy” comment, should we also not forget that there have been many instances in the past of a road team having headset problems during the game, particularly at crucial instances like after the two minute warning.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 6:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Did they bring it up to the officials?
If they did, they should have removed the ability for the Colts to communicate via radios as well. Something is in place for that exact reason.
Hell, take them away for the Colts offense while their at it. This is an easy situation to remedy.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 6:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Again, that's the rule.
We’ve sure had it happen to us…
by vintagephoenix on Nov 2, 2009 6:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Mike Singletary has long
been one of the most respected men in the NFL.
BBS is a crybaby.
It’s not CHEATING, as it can’t be proven (unlike say using steroids or throwing spitballs).
Try to follow along. Since nobody can say for sure that the players in question WEREN"T injured . . . there goes your ‘cheating’ theory.
It’s a TACTIC (used on a regular basis) designed to slow down the ‘no-huddle’ offense.
Your ‘outrage’ over a commonly used tactic in the NFL is humorous . . . and PATHETIC!
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 5:37 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
The TACTIC
is bush league at best. It also sounds like you agree they weren’t really injured, since it is a common TACTIC.
The league should look to minimize the impact of a team doing this. If you want to slow down a no-huddle offense, take a timeout, or jump offside before the ball is snapped to stop the clock, and take your 5 yard penalty. These TACTICS could easily be employed, and are not bush league.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 5:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I KNOW they weren't injured
Let’s put it this way.
If my HC was too STOOPID not to do that . . .I’d fire his ass before he took his shower after the game.
Grow up people! This is the NFL, not Pop Warner!
Too funny!
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 5:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If you ain't cheating
You ain’t trying. I see.
I’m glad we don’t root for the same team.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 5:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Again, for those of you who are 'slow'
It’s not ‘cheating.’
A) Can any of you geniuses cite a rule in the NFL rulebook against it? (Almost assuredly NOT)!
B) Since one CANNOT prove that a man’s leg didn’t ‘cramp up’ how can you say he cheated?
Try to follow along here.
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 5:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Let's see here...
You made it very clear they weren’t injured, and they wanted to slow down a no huddle offense. They should have taken a timeout, rather than try to skirt a rule that is in place to protect the players in a violent game.
It’s disingenuous, and bush league. It goes against the spirit of the game. And you are all for it.
And we are the PATHETIC ones.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 6:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
No mgrex03
I’m just an adult and a REALISTIC one at that.
This just in!: Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny and the Tooth Fairy really DON’T exist!
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Why not take a timeout in that situation?
Stop skirting the question.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 6:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Why waste a timeout when you can manufacture one?
Duh!!!!
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
We have different sets of ideals
The Colts will play the right way, and let the chips fall where they may, without “manufacturing” things that shouldn’t be there.
I’m done with you.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 6:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
okay, here ya go
The NFL’s Website has a separate section on "Timing in the Final Two Minutes of Each Half." Here’s what it says:
1. On kickoff, clock does not start until the ball has been legally touched by player of either team in the field of play. (In all other cases, clock starts with kickoff.)
2. A team cannot buy an excess time-out for a penalty. However, a fourth time out is allowed without penalty for an injured player, who must be removed immediately. A fifth time out or more is allowed for an injury and a 5-yard penalty is assessed if the clock was running. Additionally, if the clock was running and the score is tied or the team in possession is losing, the ball cannot be put in play for at least 10 seconds on the fourth or more time out. The half or game can end while those 10 seconds are run off on the clock.
3. If the defensive team is behind in the score and commits a foul when it has no time outs left in the final 40 seconds of either half, the offensive team can decline the penalty for the foul and have the time on the clock expire.
4. Fouls that occur in the last five minutes of the fourth quarter as well as the last two minutes of the first half will result in the clock starting on the snap.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 6:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
there are rules against injuries being used as timeouts, they
there ARE rules in there about faking injury, on both offense and defense. They are ever evolving. THey will get more specific over time.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 6:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Where SpazMo?
Where’s the rule?
All it says is that the ‘injured’ player has to miss one play!
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
it also says
that the clock will run if there are repeated injuries to stop the clock, even if it results in the end fo the game. its more than just missing one play. and if you want to do some research, look up the muddle huddle from the bills and bengals back in the 80s, when the nfl sent out memos telling teams that faking injuries won’t be tolerated. you can whatever you like, it doesn’t matter. we’re pathetic, you’re great, move on.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 6:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Proof?
The fact does not have to be proven for it to be a fact.
In other words, when something is true, it’s true, whether it can be proven or not.
I believe your point A) can be answered by stating that the rule is for injured players. If they aren’t really injured (and are faking it), then by definition they are not following the rules.
And as I said, (for point B), if he cheated, then he cheated, whether we can prove it or not. We can say we THINK he cheated, we can have the opinion that he cheated, but the only way to prove that someone didn’t really have a cramp is if the player admits it.
Check it to Pancakes! Pancakes!
by Picky on Nov 2, 2009 6:06 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Except that the NFL doesn't have a definition...
for injuries.
If it does, show it to me.
The fact is on EVERY PLAY players are getting banged up a little bit. If there isn’t an official NFL rule that determines whether or not a player is injured, then A PRIORI your argument falls apart. (that is, by definition)
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 6:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Obviously
the idea of “injured player” is referring to someone who is unable to continue playing. If someone got a boo-boo on their pinkie, but they can still play, then why would the rules have to make a provision for “injury”? isn’t there a rule that they have to get up from the turf in a certain amount of time, or else they must get off the field for one play?
Check it to Pancakes! Pancakes!
by Picky on Nov 2, 2009 6:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
ALL injured players have to leave the field for ONE play
or the team loses a Time-Out.
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
really?
Cite the Official NFL rule that says this. Give a link please.
Further, your comment is ridiculous. If it were true, then we wouldn’t see what we see every Sunday: injured players playing!
Give it a rest unless you have an official NFL definition of the word “injury.” If you don’t, you lose. Period.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 6:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Stop with the definition argument
An injured player is a player that requires the trainers to come onto the field to attend to him.
This is painfully obvious.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 6:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
What
is the official NFL definition?
And how do you objectively know a player “requires” the trainer?
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 6:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Right genius
The 49er players were ‘injured’ and required the trainer to come out on the field.
What part of this confuses you????
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You are the confused one Grasshopper
A rule is violated when the actions taken by definition violate the rule. In order for the actions to violate the rule, they must fit the definitions used to define the rule and a violation thereof.
So, in order for a player to cheat this particular rule, it must be shown that the definition of INJURED was not satisfied.
And therefore you must provide the NFL’s definition of the term “INJURED” and it must be shown that these players did not satisfy that definition. Period.
This is elementary logic.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 6:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
its semantics
trying to talk in circles in order to not get to the root of an argument
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 2, 2009 6:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
No
I’m just pointing out that it is impossible to show that a rule was violated unless these definitions exist, and because of this, it is impossible to show that anyone cheated.
And even more strongly, if there ISN’T an official NFL definition of the word “injured,” it is LOGICALLY IMPOSSIBLE for the 49ers to be guilty of cheating, by definition.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 6:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
but also impossible to consider any idividual
to be injured. So because there is no definition of injury players are never technically injured?
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 2, 2009 6:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Which brings us to the true issue:
The NFL allows for teams to stop the clock so long as one player leaves the field for at least one play as long as the game is not within the final 2 minutes of the first half or the final 4 minutes of the second.
This is effectively what the rule accomplishes, and it effectively means that it is NOT cheating for a team to do this.
And it means that the 49ers operated entirely within the rules, suffered their penalty (player left the field), etc.
/thread
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 6:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
So, they weren't cheating
but if the players could have continued, it COULD be said that the 49ers were playing CHEAPLY.
Like how in the early 80s teams accused the 49ers of being CHEAP with their short passing game that no one could stop.
But being CHEAP is a world apart from CHEATING.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 6:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The action shouldn't be encouraged
Or condoned (which I don’t think you specifically are doing).
I think a rule change should be looked into.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 6:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think that is what
99% of us crying foul are getting at. Its pretty bush league and needs to be addressed.
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 2, 2009 6:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
And when a rule change is made
THEN the action is cheating.
It happens every season. For example, in the 70s defensive backs would hold and maul receivers to the point that they had little chance to make a play. So the NFL modified the rule to make that kind of CHEAP defense against the rules.
But, do you think in the 70s before the 5 yard buffer rule was put into effect that that method of DB play shouldn’t have been encouraged or condoned?
Every year the NFL investigates certain things that they feel could be modified in the name of improving the game. Perhaps this tactic that the 49ers are ACCUSED of in this thread will be examined? Until it does, there is NOTHING wrong with doing it, no more so than in the 70s there was something wrong with mauling receivers more than 5 yards past the line of scrimmage.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 6:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Again, it should not
be encouraged nor condoned, even if it isn’t breaking any rules.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 6:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Okay, but do you think
that in the 70s DBs mauling receivers deep down the field should have been condoned? I would consider that cheap defensive play.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 6:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Nope
Because it was cheap. Which is why, eventually, a rule was made.
I hope the same happens for this.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 6:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Good. I'm glad to see that
you are consistent.
However, fixing this “loop-hole” isn’t really enough. The reason teams take advantage of it is BECAUSE the rules already give an unfair advantage to the offense in the no-huddle situation.
Because of that, and because I would rather not see a rule that forces no huddle offenses to wait for the defense to get set, I think it should be left alone.
The defense is already penalized by the player having to leave the field at least for one play.
Maybe the increase that duration, but fundamentally changing it would only increase a competitive advantage the offense has because of the rule structures.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 7:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I've suggested this numerous times
In this thread:
The defense will only be allowed to substitute if the offense does, much like what happens in a hurry-up/no huddle offense. The injured player may still return after sitting out one play.
I’m not in favor of increasing the duration, as there are a lot of legitimate injuries (such as getting the wind knocked out of you) that you can easily come back after only one play.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 7:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Additionally, from a competitive
standpoint, the offense already has a “cheap” advantage due to the structure of the rules, so what is wrong with defenses also taking advantage of the rules to mitigate that advantage?
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 6:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm of the mindset
That, while you should find every small advantage in football, you should also do it within the rules, and within reason.
When something goes against the spirit of the game (and I don’t think any offensive advantage falls into this category), it should not be done. Again, I’d be this upset if the Colts did it as well. It isn’t a good precedent to set.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 7:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I disagree
it is no different than an offense using motion while the QB is calling out signals at the line.
When the QB is moving or the motion is excessively jerky, it is called as a false start, but otherwise, the deliberate attempt to use motion + QB signaling to draw defenses offside is permissible within the rules and CHEAP.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 7:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
But there is a penalty
For doing this.
The offense also cannot move at all when the signals are being called, while the defensive players can, so they can go in motion as well, can stand up, move back, etc. All of them can, not just one like the offense.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 7:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, there is one
but it is a subjective call by the official, and offenses can get away with it. And do.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 7:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That's on the officials then
In the case of a “fake” injury, the official can make no call at all, other than the standard one for an injury.
It is slightly different, and I hope it is addressed sooner rather than later.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 7:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Also, the precedent was set
decades ago. Teams have been using picks on route combinations, thinking of novel formations that were allowed by the rules but were “cheap” at the time they were invented, etc, since the very beginning of the NFL.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 7:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If those things become too "cheap"
Expect harsher rules.
The Pick play is explicitly laid out, and is called, for the most part, when it happens. If it gets out of hand, a harsher rule will come out of it.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 7:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
"A harsher rule will come out of it"
Yes. The league rules will continue to evolve. However, I don’t expect much to be done about the defensive injury loop hole. The team is already penalized by losing the player for at least one play, and during the last portion of the halves the action costs a time out. There is really nothing more that they can do, or will be able to, unless this really becomes an issue.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 7:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I know you are smarter than this
There is nothing in the online version of the rulebook that explicitly lays out what happens.
I think we’ve both seen enough football games to know that when a player cannot get off the field on their own power, in a given amount of time, they stop the clock and the trainers come out. He then has to come out for 1 play.
This is your last warning about this. You seem like a very knowledgeable fan, but this is ridiculous.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 6:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
you will ban me because
my logical argument is too sound for you to crack? Are you serious? Unbelievable. I am screen capping this.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 6:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
What is your logical argument?
What have you proved?
You keep going on and on about the definition of “injury”. You know damn well what an injury is, and you keep bringing up the definition argument, like nobody knows the definition of injury. That is what I’m telling you to stop, as it has been clearly laid out for you.
And keep in mind I’ve never said it was cheating. BBS can defend his claims on his own.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 6:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Dude,
if you can’t follow the logic, the what’s the point?
As far as the word “cheating” goes, one cannot be guilty of it unless one’s actions fit the definition of cheating- do you agree with that or not?
Listen friend, it is simply poor logical happen to just say “everyone knows the definition.” I’m not even a philosopher, but I appreciate this truth. (yeah, they can be very annoying)
Since you’re not making the “cheating” accusation, I suppose I have no intellectual beef with you, but for people that are, they can either admit that they can’t solidly show that cheating occurred or they have to defeat my argument.
If not, they are “Just Saying Stuff,” which sadly has no intellectual merit.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 6:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Here's what I think
One or both of the players in question did not really have cramps.
The 49ers, by these players doing this, gained 2 additional Timeouts in the 2nd half because of this.
This act, while not technically cheating, is against the spirit of the game, and should not be condoned by anyone. It’s very bush league, and I’m glad it didn’t work, so that other teams don’t try the same shady tactics.
If the 49ers wanted to change personnel, or give their defense a break, they should have called a Timeout. They had 2 remaining until the final 2 minutes.
In order to curtail this in the future, the league should look into changing the rules when an injury occurs. It should keep the same substitution rules that happen for every other play: If the offense doesn’t substitute, than the defense cannot (or risk getting a 12 men on the field penalty).
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 6:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
There's nothing ridiculous
about this.
A) I fully concede that the injuries were ‘fake.’
B) Said ‘fake injuries’ CANNOT be proven to be fake by me, you, or anyone else short of GOD.
C) Like it or not, it’s a part of the game!
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
As far as the "definition argument,"
when discussing whether or not a rule is violated, DEFINITIONS are EVERYTHING!
The only way a rule is violated is if BY DEFINITION the actions taken violate the rule. As the rule is DEFINED, and as the parameters WITHIN the rule are DEFINED.
I mean really… how do you not understand this?
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 6:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
and the only way a team or player has CHEATED
is if they have VIOLATED A RULE!
And since the only way a rule is violated is if the action BY DEFINITION violates the rule, the argument that the 49ers CHEATED is BUNK unless they cheated BY DEFINITION, which means they broke a rule BY DEFINITION.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 6:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Picky makes NO sense
If they aren’t really injured (and are faking it), then by definition they are not following the rules.
Can you PROVE they really weren’t injured? Of course NOT!!!
Next!
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
And infact....
getting hit by someone’s bad causes mechanical stress to the human body and kills at least some living cells.
So, yeah, if they hit someone, they suffered an “injury” of sorts.
As I said, unless you have an NFL definition of the word “injury,” not a single one of these Colts fans have a leg to stand on even before we GET to the “were they faking it or not” part of the argument.
by Cartesian on Nov 2, 2009 6:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
An injury happens
when trainers come out on the field.
Stop with the bullshit semantics arguments. Being disingenuous, trying to get more Timeouts than are given to you at the start of each half, is bush league, plain and simple. I don’t care if the coach is telling them to do it, or they do it on their own.
If a Colt player did this, I’d be pissed too.
by mgrex03 on Nov 2, 2009 6:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It's called logic, Geo.
Look it up. And show me in my original post where I said it could be proven! I clearly stated, “when something is true, it’s true, whether it can be proven or not.”
Check it to Pancakes! Pancakes!
by Picky on Nov 2, 2009 6:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Say what? Picky
How can you assert that ‘something is true’ . . . if it CAN’T be proven?
Answer? You CAN’T.
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Because
truth is not determined by perception.
If we are all blind, and the sky is blue, it’s still blue whether we can perceive it or not.
If a coach tells a player to “act like you are injured if they get to 3rd down and try their no huddle stuff,” and the player does it, then he’s “faked an injury” whether it can be proven or not.
Check it to Pancakes! Pancakes!
by Picky on Nov 2, 2009 6:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Unless you can PROVE that the coach
gave the order, you cannot say that the player FAKED THE INJURY!
Get it?
Actually it’s pretty simple.
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Unfortunately
I do not work for a major news network, so I can SAY anything I like. It doesn’t mean it is true. You are missing the point, troll. If it’s true, it’s true, whether I can prove it or not. People here at SB and at SBnation in general are allowed to have these things we call “opinions”. Welcome to the free exchange of ideas.
Unless you are a lawyer, and you might be, with the way you keep hammering on “if you can’t prove it, it didn’t happen.”
Go away Mr. Troll Lawyer.
Check it to Pancakes! Pancakes!
by Picky on Nov 2, 2009 6:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Again Picky, you make NO sense
If it’s true, it’s true, whether I can prove it or not.
Really???
How can something be ‘true’ if it can’t be proven?
By your (lack of) logic, I can say that GeoMak is the smartest man on the planet Earth.
Why not? If I don’t have to ‘prove’ it, I can say it all night long.
You make NO sense!
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I can disprove it
can you disprove someone wasn’t faking an injury?
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 2, 2009 6:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
No AJ
You cannot either PROVE or DISPROVE an injury.
Duh!
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
see I can talk in circles too and we'll
waste the entire evening as well. But you’re old and probably have to head to bed soon. I mean 40+ years!!
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 2, 2009 6:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
for the record GeoMak is a Bears fan!
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 2, 2009 10:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
you're right
we’ve seen the light. thanks for clearing it up. we’re pathetic. understood. good luck with your season.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 5:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe some of you are new to this 'NFL Thing.'
I’ve been watching religiously for 40+ years.
All this ‘Fake Outrage’ for a commonly used football tactic KILLS me.
You guys are funny!
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 5:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
no outrage.
we’re pathetic. you guys rule. we’re sorry. good luck on the rest of your season.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 6:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Look, this came up on Niner Nation last night
The fact of the matter is that BBS sounds like a clown with this line of questioning.
Colt fans should (be quiet) and every night give thanks to Lindy Infante and the 1997, 3-13 Colts.
Without them, the Colts don’t have the #1 pick in 1998 when one of the biggest no brainers in the history of sports (Peyton Manning) was available in the NFL draft.
The rest, as they say, is history.
Without that ‘luck’ the Colts wouldn’t have 5,000 fans worldwide.
Shut Up, Give Thanks (especially apprpos during this time of year0 and STOP whining!
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
we're pathetic,
we’re sorry. im agreeing with you. unless everyone that agrees with you is a whiner, then i don’t know what you’re still doing talking. good luck on the rest of your season.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 6:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I thought they Texans fans were
exaggerating about Niners fans. Apparently not. However we should leave GeoMak alone because he’s been watching football for 40 years!!! Now thats tenure. He obviously knows more than us.
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 2, 2009 6:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I know what I clearly see.
The 49ers used a common tactic to slow down the ‘no-huddle.’
What a surprise!
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
geomak is a bears fan
please don’t lump all Niners fans together based off of one or two commenters. Some of us actually agree that alleged injury faking isn’t cool and that some type of rule should be put into place to put a stop to it.
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 2, 2009 10:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
oh well he was just annoying me
and I was in a troll feeding mood. The Texans fans were complaining about some “Niners fans” and I just assumed they meant him. As a whole you seemed like a reasonable fan base and though I didn’t participate in the discussions I enjoyed the back and forth commentary leading up to the game. Hopefully I didn’t offend you all for lumping him with you ;-)
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 3, 2009 1:30 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
No OUTRAGE????
Did you read BBS’s post on this subject (LOL)!
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:17 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
im about 99.9% certain
that bbs won’t respond to you, and since he’s the one you have the issue with:
thats his email address. bombs away.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 6:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't care
He responded to me last night on Niner Nation and I put him in his place there. QUICKLY!
He can’t debate me. It’s just that simple. He knows he’s in over his head against me.
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:23 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
great
so you won, he’s the one with the outrage. misdirect your greatness elsewhere. and don’t forget the lotion and a hand towel.
by SpazMo on Nov 2, 2009 6:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Only a complete moron would call Mike Singletary a BUM
Ask your former HC (Tony Dungy) if he agrees.
Almost assuredly . . . NOT!
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Keep'em coming folks.
You can ban me (I’ve been banned a million times all over the place) but you CANNOT defeat me.
It cannot be PROVEN that those players weren’t injured (unlike, say finding actual PROOF that a player used steroids or applied a foreign substance on a baseball) so it’s a meaningless accusationn.
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:15 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Go 'way, Troll.
Check it to Pancakes! Pancakes!
by Picky on Nov 2, 2009 6:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not a troll.
I’m just someone who deals in reality.
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Troll
“In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts controversial, inflammatory, irrelevant, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room or blog, with the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response” (Wikipedia)
Claim it, troll. You came to a Colts blog and are posting inflammatory messages just to provoke us. You could have made your statement and left, but you continue to argue the point. Troll.
Check it to Pancakes! Pancakes!
by Picky on Nov 2, 2009 6:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
he's been warned at 7 different blogs and banned at several of those
he’s either a very dedicated troll or just an ass
Luck is probability taken personally, clutch is probability attributed to individuals.
by shake n bake on Nov 2, 2009 6:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
No shake n bake
I’m just some who almost completly threatens those who know far, far less than me.
When they realize that they are powerles against my logic and NFL knowledge, they act like 12 year olds and ban me.
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Dude, Shake and I were at each other's throats not two days ago.
…but If you thing I think he doesn’t know football YOU are fucking retarded. If anyone here is 12, it’s you. +40years watching, what did you gestate for 30yrs?
by vintagephoenix on Nov 2, 2009 6:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
dude he's old and therefore new at this whole new fangled internet
cut him some slack
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 2, 2009 6:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm tryin'...
…but I’m 35 and have been comprehending (not watching-I’ve been watching for 31yrs) for about 22yrs. I"m jealous.
by vintagephoenix on Nov 2, 2009 6:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
So if you KNOW football
you know it’s no big deal.
Here. Lemme help you guys out here.
Type in "faking injuries to slow down no-huddle offense’ on Google.
You’ll get like, a MILLION hits.
Why?
Cause it HAPPENS ALL THE TIME!
Sheesh!
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
OH SHIT!!!!
HE KNOWS ABOUT GOOGLE!!!!! WE’RE FUCKED!!!!!!!!!!
by vintagephoenix on Nov 2, 2009 6:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
he's learning
cut him some slack.
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 2, 2009 7:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Great Picky
someone who posts controversial, inflammatory, irrelevant, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room or blog, with
Umm, that would apply to BBS with his libelous statements concerning HC Mike Singletary.
Thank you!
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Good job
cutting off the part of the definition that invalidates your point.
Troll. I’m done feeding you.
Check it to Pancakes! Pancakes!
by Picky on Nov 2, 2009 7:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You're done because I soundly defeated you
hours ago. White Flag?
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 7:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
No, BBS just SHOT his big fat mouth off last night
Who the F++K is he to call Mike Singletary a BUM?
It’s easy to shoot your mouth off over a blog. I’d like to see him say that to his face.
Pathetic.
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 6:28 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
lmao
that’s awesome. I hate that freakin kid though, my gf always makes me watch that damn show I just wanna punch him in the mouth lol
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 2, 2009 10:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The things we do for love...
Anyway I just wanted to say that I understand completely your reaction to what BBS posted. If our positions were reversed, I would probably react the same way. It’s not your fault that you don’t know what a sore subject this is for us Colts fans, and how this has more to do with the Pats than it has to do with Mike. I have nothing but respect for the 9ers and their fans. It’s good for the league to have them on the rise again and someone needs to make the NFC West into something respectable again.
To make sure this is “on topic”, I have to say that I wanted to watch some game tape before deciding if this was cheating or not. BBS is entitled to his view of things, and as a good host, he said something guaranteed to “cause discussion”. I need to watch this at length, and I’ll hold my opinion until I do. Colts crowds aren’t known for being uncaring to injury, so I have to give alot of creedence to the strength of their reaction. Idk…
by vintagephoenix on Nov 3, 2009 2:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
...

Visit FanIQ.com for sports news, bloggings, polls, and more!
by MrNFL on Nov 2, 2009 7:09 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
There's no argument
BBS shot his big fat mouth off . . . and he and others like him can’t satnd to be put in their place.
That’s not an argument. That’s reality.
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 7:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
so lets sum up your argument
it happens all the time. You’ve been on here all day and your “superior intellect” can be summed up with ZOMG!!!111 IT HAPPENS ALL TEH TIMEZ!!!11
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 2, 2009 7:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Right
It’s a part of the game (to anyone who actually KNOWS something about the game).
To those that don’t (starting with BBS and spreading outward) it’s a crime of epic proportions.
Hysterical!
by GeoMak on Nov 2, 2009 7:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Impressed with the vast knowledge you've proved you possess

Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 2, 2009 7:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
damn!
http://bp2.blogger.com/tm33tTS2iZc/SBLN8mm0HJI/AAAAAAAAA54/4yAhNgVOCc/s1600-h/mot4.gif
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 2, 2009 7:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
unfortunately we will no longer be graced with GeoMak's vastly superior football knowledge
thanks to his totally inability to talk to other people in a tone even vaguely resembling respectfulness. He’s been banned and warned at several other blogs for the exact same behavior and lacks the ability or desire to change.
Luck is probability taken personally, clutch is probability attributed to individuals.
by shake n bake on Nov 2, 2009 7:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well, I think this get us ready for the Texans trolls this week.
Saw an old friend in this thread.
by vintagephoenix on Nov 2, 2009 7:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
he does this exact same thing over on Niners Nation allll the time.
he hasn’t been banned yet, but probably just because Fooch doesn’t really ban people.
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 2, 2009 10:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Big Blue Shoe is the tool, I can't believe I apologized for previous statement just to have this douche bag
Post on NN and again disrespect the coach. All you (site decorum) (calling Sing a cheater) can kiss the baby, Addai DID do the same thing resulting in a quick snap pass for a 3rd down conversion. If your QB is so good you should have been able to get the 3rd down without cheating. I can’t wait until you get your asses kicked in the playoffs as usual and start your usual crying and finger pointing and bitching. You’re a bunch of whiny sore losers and you have been since Manning has been here. The best QB in the regular season and one of the worst in the post season, CHEERIO! I hate the Pats but I hope they kick your ass since they bring the biggest bitch out of you guys. So Stick your Big Blue Shoe up your huge (site decorum)hole!
"Optimist Prime"
"Child Please" -Ochocinco
by rlott#42 on Nov 4, 2009 12:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Man,
I don’t know that one, and I know lots of animes.
Now a proud annoyance on Stampede Blue, 18to88, Indy Football Report, and Phil B's blog.
Man, I need a life...
Random fact of the week from the empty void that is my mind: Viz Media (The creators of my absolute favorite show of all-time and inspiration to my avatar, Naruto) just announced a partnership with the channel Disney XD to bring the English-dubbed episodes of Naruto Shippuden (The continuation of the Naruto series) to that station with a new episode airing each week, starting, well, NOW. With the series recording I just put on it, this is one of the greatest days I've had in a long time. I'm not kidding. I love the show that much.
by Cassieper on Nov 5, 2009 5:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Oh yeah!

Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Nov 2, 2009 7:11 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Looks like most of your bloggers to me, fake ass tough guys, internet gangstas!!
"Optimist Prime"
"Child Please" -Ochocinco
by rlott#42 on Nov 4, 2009 12:37 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Doah!
<img src=“”http://media.photobucket.com/image/this is a troll i can tell/Saborlas/Countertroll/lookslikeatroll.jpg?o=1" target="_blank">
"/>
by vintagephoenix on Nov 2, 2009 7:21 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I are stupid at this...
<img src=“”0" width=“491” style=“border: none; font-family: Myriad, Helvetica, Verdana, sans-serif;”>
"/>
by vintagephoenix on Nov 2, 2009 7:23 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Try again...
<img src=“”http://media.photobucket.com/image/this is a troll i can tell/hedonisticpleasureseeker/Please_Do_Not_Feed_The_Troll.jpg?o=1" target="_blank">
"/>
by vintagephoenix on Nov 2, 2009 7:28 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I didn't see anyone post the rule...
…so I figured I would. From the NFL 2009 rule book:
Supplemental to Rule 4, Section 4, Article 4:
“(4)The Rules Committee deprecates feigning injuries, with subsequent withdrawal, to
obtain a timeout without penalty. Coaches are urged to cooperate in discouraging
this practice.”
Therefore, definitively, feigning injury is not against the rules in this instance. It’s just frowned upon, because you obviously can’t prove it one way or the other. Circumstantial evidence, however, goes a long way in my opinion.
by linkish on Nov 3, 2009 2:58 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Should the NFL look into Singletary"s "cheating"?
Aparently you are convinced Mike Singletary is a bum and cheater based on the possibility that two of his players faked injuries. If indeed they did cheat, don’t you think the NFL would or should do something about it? My guess is they won’t because there is NO proof that they did. For you to question Singletary"s integrity based on what may or may not have happened speaks volumes about your integrity. I would love to see you tell him what you think of his integrity to his face. Anybody can sit in an office and type all manor of b.s. about someone else without any fear of being called out on it. Nice article.
by hegralow on Nov 4, 2009 9:56 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
If that was a stragedy it would have happened a lot more since you were running a lot of no huddle
"Optimist Prime"
"Child Please" -Ochocinco
by rlott#42 on Nov 4, 2009 12:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
People are still posting in this thread?
by vintagephoenix on Nov 4, 2009 2:09 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
ANGRY FANS ARE ANYGR!
see, so mad that they can’t spell straight.
Go Colts!
by Marked Hoosier on Nov 4, 2009 3:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
How about....
the fact that the Colts funnel in fake crowd noise to make it louder and harder to communicate for opposing teams? Isn’t that cheating as well?
by sanfranfanmdk on Nov 4, 2009 3:39 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I like you...
you are funny.
Go Colts!
by Marked Hoosier on Nov 4, 2009 3:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Kevin Lynch is your source?
He’s is widely known as the worst sports writer for the 49ers and accusing Sing of cheating is sheer crap.
by Mullester on Nov 4, 2009 10:00 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I hate to bring a post from a few years ago in
but:
“Gee, I’ve never seen whining from a team after they’ve WON a game, but I guess that’s just how they roll in Bawston. Whine when they lose. Whine when they win. I guess they’re mad that they didn’t get to roll up 40 points on a team, or that their offense spent most of the day peeling themselves off the RCA turf rather than doing cartwheels into the endzone.
Honestly, is the collective age maturation of the New England Patriots that of a ten-year-old?”
Am I the only one sensing a tad bit of hypocriticalness here?
Praying that Tim Alderson doesn't come back to bite us
by MadBum on Nov 5, 2009 9:24 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
and if that doesn’t work: http://www.stampedeblue.com/2007/11/5/154525/504
Praying that Tim Alderson doesn't come back to bite us
by MadBum on Nov 5, 2009 9:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

by 































