Colts to Rest Starters When #1 Seed is Clinched
by Z.Pain on Nov 30, 2009 1:17 PM EST
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PrintHere is the article - http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writers/peter_king/11/30/week12/1.html
Personally, I hate this move...every year we have done this, we end up being a one-and-done playoff team. The year we won the SB, we played the last game vs. Miami to get the #3 seed, and played KC in the wildcard round and rolled right along to a championship. Resting our guys has never...never...never...helped us in recent years. We've lost to SD, and Pittsburgh. The fact of the matter is, we are a momentum team (20 in a row proves that), and the minute you take these guys out of game-situations in the regular season and try to adjust to the game like atmosphere in the play-offs, it is a little too late. On top of that, we have players like Gonzo (played less than a half) and Hayden (missed ample time) who need to get back into the swing of things. This doesn't mean leaving Gonzo out there with Painter or Sorgi....Peyton puts the ball where it needs to be, not where the receiver is...our entire offense is based on communication, mutual understanding and timing, and clearly, Gonzo needs to get back into the swing of things with the #1 QB and the #1 offense as a whole.
I understand that trying to push for an undefeated season is a lot of pressure, and could result in even more pressure in the playoffs, but I still don't see what good comes out of intentionally losing a game (ie. playing your subs)....Even if the first string team is in for 3 quarters, that is good enough, but the whole 2 series and done approach sucks! And to be honest, I would like all cylinders of our team to click at the same time, in the beginning of the game. Not giving up 17 points before answering, and not coming back from 17 points in the 4th quarter...eventually, we will play a team that if they take a 17 point lead, may not giving that up. For example, a team with a diesel run game that can milk the clock in the playoffs such as the Ravens, Steelers, and re surging Chargers. Our team operates best when we take a 2 score lead, because we have that fierce pass rush, and when we know they have to throw, we know we can aggressively attack without worrying much about the run.
Just my take, and I know some of you may disagree with this opinion...but I am a believer in learning from history.
Thanks for reading!
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Stampede Blue's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Stampede Blue's writers or editors.
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Resting
And when we rest people and it helps us go on to win another Super Bowl, this silly, tired argument will hopefully DIE ALREADY!
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I disagree...
You have a bye week, you have basically a full week to rest up…if guys are banged up come week 15, fine, rest ’em, but if they are healthy, why not play em? The fear of injury? What happened to NEXT MAN UP? We preach this over and over again…
This isn’t a silly and tired argument…this is a legitimate cause for concern when it comes to the Colts…when we rest our guys we LOSE! I am not basing this on anything more than trends in the past! Look at the past -
2005 NFL AFC South 1st 14 2 0 Lost Divisional Playoffs (Steelers) 21-18
2007 NFL AFC South 1st 13 3 0 Lost Divisional Playoffs (Chargers) 28-24
2008 NFL AFC South 2nd 12 4 0 Lost Wild Card Playoffs (Chargers) 23-17
In 2008, we rested our players against the Titans in the last game of the year before the wild card round…the rest of em, well, that speaks for itself. Believe me, I would love nothing more than to be able to rest our guys and make a play-off run, however, I will say it again, we are a team of momentum and our offense requires repetition and consistency to operate at such a high-level. This doesn’t come in practice…this comes in game-time experience.
There is a lot more going on then just the resting of the players. I’m pretty sure DZ did an excellent rebuttal to this a while ago; i think this is basically what they wrote.
First, what people don’t understand about the colt’s playoff failures is that this is a team of stars and average joes. That is, there are 5 people that are essential to this team: Manning, Freeney, Wayne, Saturday, Brackett. When they are injured we lose. For the rest, next man up applies, but not for these guys.
In 2008, we didn’t have Brackett (and lost because we could not cover antonio gates) or our entire offensive line.
In 2007, we didn’t have freeney for the playoffs, so we lost.
In 2006, we had freeney, brackett, wayne, manning, saturday and WON the superbowl.
I don’t think we had any major injuries in 2005, and we lost to the steelers by a field goal who went on to win the super bowl. On that day, we were the worse team.
Resting your starters makes sense. We are not a team of momentum. We are a team of professionals. And if we lose some of our essential components in a meaningless game, that is far more devestating to our playoff chances then “maintaining chemistry”.
Finally, what about the almighty pats in 2007. They not only didn’t rest their starters, they went out and ABUSED people through every single week. And yet, they still lost. But, for some reason I don’t hear the same “oh my god” they should have rested thier starters, maybe the defense would have been fresher and stopped eli in the 4th quarter nonsense.
It doesn't make sense.
This IS a team of momentum. Have you not watched the past couple games? Momentum can be a game changer anytime.
2008 Brackett is lost NOT on the last game of the season.
2007 Freeney is lost NOT on the last game of the season.
2005 Colts rested too much and got kicked in the ass deservingly so.
2004 Colts did well one game of playoffs and then got kicked in the ass. Don’t know what to tell you about that one.
Did you even watch the game in 2005? Colts downright SUCKED in that game until the 4th quarter. Alas, 4th quarter come back wasn’t enough.
Almost everyone I’ve seen so far blamed Vandershank for that game. Guess what folks, he didn’t lose us that game. Tony Dungy and other people lost us that game. Yes, Peyton Manning and others are included in that list.
What do you think the bye is for? It’s called resting. If you don’t have the bye, it makes sense to rest the starters on the last week of regular season. But if you DO have the bye, two or more weeks of off week WILL make the Colts get rusty. Just watch the 2005 game.
In 2007, all the teams that rested their players didn’t make it to the SB. The two teams that did not rest players made it to the SB. Alas, you can’t have two SB winners in 2007. That’s the only reason why you don’t hear that.
Oh no!
I was not saying they were lost on the last game. It doesn’t matter when we “lost” them.
Look, there is a cost in terms of chemistry from resting, I get that, I get why people get pissed off. I also realize that not having that instant chemistry may cause us to lose in the opening round. BUT, losing an essential player to injury will DOOM any chance of a super bowl.
So it is a relatively simple choice: play out the season and risk losing a super bowl chance or risk being rusty in one game. Given our ability to turn it on in the second half, i’ll take our chances to win that game with a healthy roster.
If the key player is injured, fine. Rest them, no need to rest everyone. Rest the injury prone guys.
That bye is there for a reason. It’s there to give a team time to heal up, and it’s also there to give a team rust. The problem about playoffs is that EVERY TEAM is good. EVERY TEAM is drooling to win, especially against a team like Colts.
Also, resting that one game isn’t going to change anything a ton. If they are knocked out earlier in the season, they are already goners.
Risk injury? Chemistry is worth the risk. Timing is worth the risk. Remember 2007 Marvin Harrison? Oh yeah, rest the guy. Oh yeah, he’s been playing over a decade his timing with Manning won’t get hurt. Oh yeah, he’s going to be perfectly healthy. And he ended up ruining the momentum for us in the game, might as well have been THE reason why Colts lost the game.
Oh no!
You know.....
I was in the middle of typing a lengthy response to this, then realized that it was too long for a comment. I’m going to make a separate post which will examine the last week and playoff games for the Manning era to see if there is any correlation between resting starters, because this post screams of cherry-picking. I hope to put a serous dent in this argument, and have the data handy for later use for when people bring up this argument again.
Look for this post later today, as it could take a little while, and I still have class.
"I am in favor of censorship ‐ not against what is supposed to be sexy or dirty, but against what is idiotic." -Jean Renoir
Random fact of the week from the empty void that is my mind: What should you do if a hot dog vendor gives you a free hot dog? Why, throw it on the ground, of course.
you always have class
Not like San Diego “class” or New England “class,” either.
See, now I have work to do but am dedicated enough to blow it off for my team.
Come on, take one for the team.
(yes, I am kidding and would never seriously say this as a youth or oldth.)
I hate Joe Namath. That's how long I've been a Colts fan.
Actually,
there may have to be a small hiatus on this post. I can see now that I’m starting to work on it that it’s going to take a lot more time that I thought, especially since I’m working extremely hard to take any subjective stuff out of it and do it from a purely statistical/correlation standpoint. I also have other things to do since I’m in college and all.
The post will come, but it’s going to be a little while. Luckily, this argument will be continuing for another 6 weeks, so it’s not like I have ot put a rush order on it.
"I am in favor of censorship ‐ not against what is supposed to be sexy or dirty, but against what is idiotic." -Jean Renoir
Random fact of the week from the empty void that is my mind: What should you do if a hot dog vendor gives you a free hot dog? Why, throw it on the ground, of course.
I didnt read the article
cause as soon as I opened it Peter Kings big ugly melon popped up and I therefore I automatically dismiss it. Here’s my thoughts…
If the Colts are undefeated when we play the Bills, there’s no way we rest starters. Now…in the 4th quarter garbage time when the Colts are up by a massive amount points, THEN will Peytons tooshie (and most of the rest of the starters) be on the bench. Jim Caldwell is a very different, yet very much like Dungy. He takes more risks and is way more aggressive. I think in the back of his mind he is thinking about 16-0. If the Colts are on a roll…the starters will play the entire season. This again is my own humble opinion and does not necessarily reflect the views of Stampede Blue’s writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Stampede Blue’s writers or editors.
Bob Sanders does not play Hide-and-Seek, He plays HIDE and PRAY-HE-DOES-NOT FIND-YOU!
I STILL think it's all context
If someone “could” play but would benefit from rest (and limited practice), we’ll do it to preserve the playoffs. Better to enter the playoffs through the eye of the needle at #3 seed with 53 healthy guys, than conquer the league 16-0 but have lost your soul (or lead pass rusher).
whew, that was mighty biblical of me.
I think Freeney’s a great example. If this was a playoff game, he plays. But if we can rest him a couple more weeks, and get him to 100%, then win or lose, it’s the right move. I doubt we will wholesale rest entire units, but cherry pick the guys who need it. Not out of injury fear (which is the traditional reason) but out of injury healing.
And our team with Sorgi under center and a couple other backups can still beat Buff. It’s not giving up on the 16-0 season to sub about 5 guys. In fact, if Freeney rests another game or two, and Gonzo just comes back then, and Hayden, it would really be their tune-up games like Clark at the end of 2006.
We will and should rest some guys, but not the whole roster. make sure 18 and 11 get decent reps, like 8 consecutive passes, before 18 sits, and we’re good.
I hate Joe Namath. That's how long I've been a Colts fan.
For what shall it profit a man
to gain the number one seed but lose his own franchise quarterback?
by coltsfanawalt on Nov 30, 2009 8:06 PM EST up reply actions
Nice
Biblical analogy
Bob Sanders does not play Hide-and-Seek, He plays HIDE and PRAY-HE-DOES-NOT FIND-YOU!
by coltsfan723 on Nov 30, 2009 11:57 PM EST up reply actions
This article makes me happy! As long as the Steelers make the playoffs, that is.
If not…
Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever.
Napoleon Bonaparte
Stampede Blue's Resident Steelers Fan
I need to find another stupid artifice to put here
by LV Steelers Fan on Nov 30, 2009 4:28 PM EST reply actions
You know...
I really don’t care anymore… As much as I absolutely hate Colts resting their starters, it’s not like us arguing about it here will change the coaches’ minds or anything.
If the coaches want the team to get kicked in the rear end again in the playoffs, just let them. Let them be too conservative (or too liberal)… Let the team lose in the playoffs, again, again, and again… Really couldn’t care anymore about this issue.
Oh no!
In the words of one Reginald Wayne
“whenever this team gets anything close to a bye week during the playoffs, we just don’t respond well…” (paraphrasing, of course).
On that note: The Colts will rest starters, it’s what they do.
I am OK with that IF
They let the starters play the whole game week 17. If we are going to let our starters rest, they will need some kind of preparation to let all the rust off. I don’t want to spend a half in the playoffs for our team to let the rust go. We were so Rusty when we played Pittsburgh in 2004 we were too late shaking off the rust to make a comeback.Yes we should have tied it with a FG, but we also beat that team by 19 in reg season. So we should have never been in too deep of a hole.
Manning 2009 MVP
by INDYCOLTSROCK18 on Nov 30, 2009 5:43 PM EST reply actions
Anybody remember Cornelius Bennett?
We go through this debate every year. To refresh your memory, in 2000, Peyton’s second year here and first year in the playoffs. The Colts signed Bennett to be their middle linebacker. He had a history of knee injuries, but was a great player when healthy. He played every game that year, was the heart and soul of the Colts defense. Very good at stopping the run. The Colts played Buffalo the last game of the year in Buffalo, with the second spot (a first round bye wrapped up) and no reason to play their starters. Mora was adamant that they were going to play their starters. So we did. First play of the game Buffalo runs a sweep, Bennett give chase to make the tackle. He gets blocked with a helmet to the knee, has torn ligaments, and is done for the year. Tennessee comes to Indy for the playoff, and spends the whole game running up the middle, (against Bennett’s replacement) and wins the game because of the loss of Bennett.
If we had rested Bennett in that game, had he played and the Colts won, which is probably what would have happened, how different would the Colts have fared in the playoffs in future years if they have won that game. Resting starters and getting to the playoffs healthy is the only way to go.
Yes, but it didnt quite work out as you remember
As I can remember Eddie George had only gained a little over 30 yards by half time of that game. The Colt’s D held them to 6 points, but Manning was off his game and a usually good offense had to settle for three field goals for 9 points. Eddie picked it up later in the game and they won 19-16, but that game had very much to do with an ice cold Colts offense than with Cornelius Bennett missing the game. 9 freaking points by halftime is awful production for a Manning-led offense.
As good as Cornelius was as an emotional leader (he no longer was in his prime when he joined the Colts); this game was lost on offense. The offense was simply out of sync. I jot that down on resting an offense that relies on timing. Had Manning lighted up the score boards as usual, the Titans would’ve been force to throw the ball instead they kept pounding the ball until that big run by Eddie George. So even this game is an example AGAINST resting the players than for it.
But a very good young player...
He threw for over 4,000 yards and was named a Pro bowler. The Colts offense was much better than to score just one TD. Had the offense score TDs instead of settling for FGs the Titans would’ve been force to abandon the run in the second half.
My point is that you’d normally expect the Colts to win a game where the opponent only scores 19 points in a Manning led offense. So my point is that game had little to do with Cornelius Bennett and the defense.
The reason the Colts lost in 2006 to the Steelers
was simply because Dungy didn’t stick to the running game. Had the Colts done that they would have rolled over the Steelers like they had earlier in the season. Dungy ensured he would never make that mistake again, and proved this the following season when he won the Superbowl.
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