The Two Plays That Really Got Me
by emiller17 on Nov 11, 2010 2:09 AM EST
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PrintThe loss doesn't get any easier as the week goes along. I've come to the conclusion that third down defense is what did us in. Whether it was blitzes with lost containment as discussed by Collin, throwback jerseys as proposed by bluecoltsfan, a couple of poor draft classes over the last few years or the MASH unit that is our injury list, it was a tough game all around. What makes this all the more unbearable is that now we have to listen to segments from sports pundits about how great the Eagles played. I will admit, that Michael Vick looked better than I have EVER seen him. Props to his new found QB method. I will be watching to see how long it lasts.
What really gets under my skin is something that Devil's Reject touched on in this week's Devil's Take. While we all complain about the officiating in the NFL from time to time. He has mentioned for a few weeks how bad things seem to have gotten. I went back and looked at the game film there were two plays that REALLY turned the tide of the game.
We all remember when Patty Mac pinned the Iggles at the one early in the game and the defense forced them into a third and 7 situation. Francisco gets caught flat footed as Jackson even and is then leavin'. Vick throws a great pass about 60 yards in the air to hit Jackson. Mike Mayock on the early week Playbook pointed to this play as an example of the GREAT Eagles pass protection. He applauded the scheme for getting Mathis wide and chipped and making Freeney take a long route on the inside loop. Truth. Good scheme. Want to see the real reason Vick had enough time to throw. Let's look at Eric Foster on the play.
This first picture of the alignment for the play.
Foster gets a good jump of the line.
The block starts out clean.
Watch the RG grab Fosters outside shoulder and hold on to it. You can see the arm extended across Foster's jersery.
Here's another look at it from the high angle. See the shoulder grab that stopped Foster in his tracks?
Would Foster have gotten the sack? I doubt it. But that IS a penalty! AND it's in the END ZONE! That means a Safety and 2 points Colts. MORE IMPORTANT than that, the Eagles would be punting from their 20 yard line, into a wind that would later cause a 19 yard punt. It's not out of the realm of possibility that Colts would have gotten the ball back at the 40 or 50 yard line. Think about the MOMENTUM that would have changed hands there!
The other play that really killed me was much later in the game. Fast forward with me to the end of the third quarter. The Eagles are ahead 19 to 17 and driving. The defense forces a 3rd and 4 at the 50 yard line. A stop here would make for a tough decision for Reid and Gang Green. Vick ends up getting loose for a 32 yard run down to the Colts 18. This leads to a TD for the Eagles that makes it very tough for the Colts to have a chance to win the game. How did Vick get free you ask? Let's watch Keunta Dawson on this play. Mathis had beaten Justice one on one a couple of times in this drive already and once drawn a holding penalty.
Dawson in for Mathis on the left end of the line and gets off the ball well looking to school Justice again.
Push upfield...
Turn the corner!
Here's a good look at Dawson with Justice's arm across his face. You can see him bent backward with an arm around his neck. This is the hold we see ALL THE TIME against the Colts DEs.
Again, can I guarantee that Dawson gets him if he's not held? No I can't, but I can guarantee that he WON'T get him if he's being held. If there is a hold called there what does that do to the game? If the hold is marked from the spot of the foul, it becomes 3rd and 24 at the Eagles 36 instead of 1st and 10 at the Colts 18. Again, one play...HUGE swing.
Are these plays the reason why we lost the game? No, that was our inability to get off the field on third down. These are just two third downs where we were put at a an unfair disadvantage. My point is that the officials have not been calling the rules as they are written for a long time now. What is a holding on one play or for one team, is not one for the other. Are these always against the Colts? Of course not, but with the speed of our DEs, there are many more times that the offensive player is given so much leeway that the playing field is not level. I'm sick of yelling about it, but I can't stop myself. On both of the plays highlighted, there is an official staring at the play. These people are professionals, the best in their field, and are as inconsistent as any Friday night HS ref in Indiana! UNACCEPTABLE. PERIOD.
I hope to use the new capture method to break down something other than the officials in the future. I just couldn't get over these during this week.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Stampede Blue's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Stampede Blue's writers or editors.
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Thanks for catching that.
It was late last night. I was hoping it was someone other than the big two, since those are the ones we always talk about. See, it doesn’t just happen to Dwight and Robert!
Bleedin' Blue for as long as I can remember. Can you believe we get to be fans while our team has the greatest QB of all time?!?!?!
Thanks!
I wanted to pull clips for your whole list, but didn’t have time. I thought it would be better to look at these two.
Bleedin' Blue for as long as I can remember. Can you believe we get to be fans while our team has the greatest QB of all time?!?!?!
Comparison to last year
I am very curious if the lack of holding penalties has something to do with the new location of the Umpire…..oh and that most of them are 165 years old and don’t see well. That’s really the only reason why you wouldn’t throw a flag when a guy is dragging our DE’s to the ground in a sleeper hold. But it would be nice to see a Year to Year comparison since the change.
I've stated it before,
I don’t think they know what a hold looks like from that angle. The league ‘Rushed’ This in and probably did not take the necessary time to train the officials what a hold looks like from the new spot, caveat being there is only one moved official and the other 6 are in the same spot.
I realize that having an ‘officials training conference’ where you would have all of the officials going to a central location for training (The Luke the week between PS and Kickoff of regular season anyone? Bueler? Bueler?) would be a very costly thing not to mention that it would take the officials who are already gone at least 21? (17 reg and 4 preseason) weekends a year away from their families.
Or maybe have copies of a training DVD each NFL facility, and the refs have to watch them before each game for the first 4 games of the season (It is manditory to watch them before every game with the Colts). Possibly include testing week 5 and if you fail then you are suspended and/or fined. I am all for forcing officiating crews to be under the same review process as players, the League office reviews a game and says to the crew, you guys missed 3 game breaking penalties give us $10K each, also repeat offenders, we are looking at you Mr. Ron Winters, will be suspended.
They already do some sort of rating of the officials to figure out the crew that does the Super Bowl, why not use the same scale in a more visible manner.
by sandtiger812 on Nov 11, 2010 10:02 AM EST up reply actions
Even if a process like that were in place...
the NFL would NEVER make it public. especially any fines that were levied. That would be them admitting they had a problem. Not gonna happen.
Bleedin' Blue for as long as I can remember. Can you believe we get to be fans while our team has the greatest QB of all time?!?!?!
Nice analysis
I’ve heard that offensive holding calls aren’t consistently called , or only a small percentage are called, in part because this has become a ’Passer’s League’. Not sure I totally believe it, but perhaps there’s some method to the madness. Good research project would be to analyze film to see if these inconsistencies and ‘let ’em play’ atttitudes are consistent across officials, teams, years, etc. Gotta think if they pulled the flag every time Freeney (for instance) was actually held the slow gameplay would be a huge turn-off to a TV audience who obviously values fast-moving sports (NFL) over slow (MLB) on the tube.
Wasn’t putting the official in the backfield supposed to draw more flags for offensive holding? So, how that’s working out…?
"Keep your government hands off my Medicare!!!" ~ 2009 quote of the year, Yale Book of Quotations
"Well, I've been to one world fair, a picnic, and a rodeo, and that's the stupidest thing I ever heard."
I wish I had the film to do that.
I would LOVE to go back and pull the steady camera angles (the All 22 that the NFL doesn’t allow fans to watch) to look for trends. I’m SURE there are tends across the board that the NFL doesn’t really want out there. See the black eye that baseball is getting right now over the replay debate right now. All the MSM analysts are afraid of pissing off the monster that is the NFL so they won’t yell about the officiating.
I think the point is well made about DEs getting held on the outside. The Umpire in the backfield is NOT adding any more penalties in those situations, which are the easiest to see from the new position. No clue why. Maybe they were told not to watch that and only look inside. I could not tell you, but it pisses me off in EVERY NFL game I watch.
Bleedin' Blue for as long as I can remember. Can you believe we get to be fans while our team has the greatest QB of all time?!?!?!
ahh, yes, proprietary information
I hadn’t thought of that, but it would certainly open them up to a lot of unwanted scrutiny and second guessing. Not good for ‘The Game’ and all that. Offering volumes of players’ stats are one thing, evidence for second-guessing the officiating is quite another.
Keep up your screen-capture analysis…the proof is in the pictures.
"Keep your government hands off my Medicare!!!" ~ 2009 quote of the year, Yale Book of Quotations
"Well, I've been to one world fair, a picnic, and a rodeo, and that's the stupidest thing I ever heard."
Haha, wow...
You guys are not used to losing, and that’s a compliment to the Colts’ organization for being so successful over the past decade. I say that because I have never seen this level of ridiculous whining after a loss. “The Eagles fans booed Collie. The refs missed a holding call.” Are you guys serious? Are you forgetting the atrocious roughing the passer call on Trent Cole that led to 7 points and almost cost them the game? The horrible unnecessary roughness call on Collie’s injury that led to 7 more points?
The Eagles beat the Colts… Soundly. I know that losses suck. I feel you. Ruins the whole week. But man up. This complaining and whining is embarrassing.
by JimmyK on Nov 12, 2010 4:48 PM EST via mobile reply actions
2 points with a chance to win...
is now soundly….You didn’t even cover the spread.
The call on Cole was correct, by the rule book. Is it a stupid rule, HELL YES!
There is a rule still on the book that helmet to helmet contact is not allowed. Refs just called the wrong one. Helmet to helmet, not defenseless receiver. Same penalty though.
This kind of post is something I’ve been wanting to do for awhile. I just hadn’t gotten capture capabilities yet. You just got lucky that it happened to be this week so instead of talking about it, I could show pictures.
Bleedin' Blue for as long as I can remember. Can you believe we get to be fans while our team has the greatest QB of all time?!?!?!
The Eagles clearly outplayed Indy. There’s no debating that.
by JimmyK on Nov 12, 2010 5:37 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
if that was the case then why are you here trying to defend the win instead of being on your own blog celebrating it.
LMAO @ Outplayed
When your bragging rights consist of beating a team playing 3rd and 4th string players at several key positions, I guess that is outplaying them…
by DevilsReject on Nov 12, 2010 8:02 PM EST up reply actions
fuck you. and a pox on you and your family. i don't even care if i get in trouble for saying this.
"We'll put em in the pot, shake it up and see what comes out." - Howard Mudd
"Nothing's complicated if you understand it." - Tom Moore
"It always takes longer than you expect, even when you take into account Hofstadter's Law." - Hofstadter's Law
Dallas Clark is
Just. This. Incredible.
by McAfee#1 on Nov 13, 2010 7:44 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
errr…what did I say to deserve that response? I was (sarcastically) pointing out that every team has injuries at key positions. Eagles fans know this all too well…think about all the times you heard of McNabb being out.
Eh, whatever. Sorry if I pissed you off (kind of). I tried to be pretty diplomatic since I’m not a Colts fan and I don’t approve of trolling. However, you guys are quite the hostile bunch to other fans.
i came in in a bad mood. i apologize for taking it out on you, and would like to formally withdraw both my fuck you and my pox.
"We'll put em in the pot, shake it up and see what comes out." - Howard Mudd
"Nothing's complicated if you understand it." - Tom Moore
"It always takes longer than you expect, even when you take into account Hofstadter's Law." - Hofstadter's Law
Dallas Clark is
Just. This. Incredible.
And, to be fair,
There have been several Eagle’s fans who have been here and said things that have been incorrect, trolling, and downright dumb. Many Colts fans have become quite fed up with them, and sometimes assume that the Eagles fans here are quite simply, dumb and annoying. This assumption is of course not true, but many of us have it nonetheless, and most likely will continue to have it while Eagles fans continue to come and post while we are still pissed.
Peyton Manning= Better.
by JesusNinja13 on Nov 14, 2010 8:01 PM EST up reply actions
on injuries
First I want to say that this is not meant to take anything away from the eagles. But I’m not sure you fully appreciate the depths of Indy’s injury woes this year.
Our 5th string undrafted rookie RB saw heavy snaps against the eagles (and scored 2 touchdowns). after collie went out the No. 5 (undrafted, rookie, practice squad) WR came in. We’ve had to bring up our No. 6 (undrafted, rookie) WR from the PS for the next game, and even so i think the colts only will have 3 dressed WRs against the bengals due to injury.
Dallas Clark is gone for the year. His replacement left the philly game with an injury. Our excellent 5th round rookie blocking TE didn’t dress for the philly game. We’ve had to bring back a TE we CUT earlier this year, and who sucks. We dressed an offensive guard as a TE, for the second game in a row.
we’re down to a “4th string” strong safety who we brought in off the street, our LB corps is turbofucked, and we started our nickely cornerback.
Oh, and our Oline sucks. no, really, they’re terrible. Saturday is clearly the best, and as much as i love him, as great as he’s been for years, he’s on the decline. Our RT is washed up. our LT is a converted guard, and as much as I love HIS hustle and effort, he’s below mediocre. our RG is arguably a second round bust, our LG just lost his job to a guy playing CFL football two years ago.) They’re getting better now that they’ve had some time to play together and develop cohesiveness, but they suck. I give lots of credit to the eagles dline for playing great, but they were abusing a bad oline.
The colts are almost as injured as the bills were last year. there’s a team that got turbofucked by injuries. didn’t they have to replace their entire oline or something, some more than once and brought in 8 or 9 running backs or something? they lost a TON of defensive starters. I know they ended the year with 20 players on IR.
obviously the colts are not the only team dealing with critical injuries. and maybe it shouldn’t be used as an “excuse” for why the colts lost, but IT IS A CONTRIBUTING REASON. after collie went out, the colts could barely get anything going on offense excepting finishing out the drive at the half. which just shows how critical the slot receiver is to this offense and how bad the loss of Dclark might end up being.
"We'll put em in the pot, shake it up and see what comes out." - Howard Mudd
"Nothing's complicated if you understand it." - Tom Moore
"It always takes longer than you expect, even when you take into account Hofstadter's Law." - Hofstadter's Law
Dallas Clark is
Just. This. Incredible.
update on WRs
and our No. 7 rookie, undrafted rookie WR to bring the total up to 4 WRs, since technically brandon james, aforementioned undrafted rookie “No. 6” WR is actually listed as a RB.
"We'll put em in the pot, shake it up and see what comes out." - Howard Mudd
"Nothing's complicated if you understand it." - Tom Moore
"It always takes longer than you expect, even when you take into account Hofstadter's Law." - Hofstadter's Law
Dallas Clark is
Just. This. Incredible.
maybe you hadn't noticed
but this is the colts blog. don’t tell me that you never complain about uncalled penalties after losses, don’t even try because i know it’s bullshit. IT’S WHAT FANS DO. we’re allowed to complain about it amongst ourselves; we’re allowed to wonder about things that might have changed the game, just as much as you are after losses. THIS IS THE COLTS BLOG, a fanpost DIRECTED AT COLTS FANS. you are TROLLING. congratulations.
man up, are you kidding me? fuck you. The eagles outplayed the colts; vick certainly outplayed manning. but the eagles did not “win soundly”. Soundly is obviously a subjective measurement, anyway, and scores can be a deceptive measurement of it, but to me soundly is generally going to be in the realm of 1TD+ and/or being in control the whole game. “Soundly winning” is beating the giants by 24 in a game, not letting a banged up (yes, we are, more than any other team in the league right now; last week our 5th string running back saw heavy snaps (and scored two TDs against your defense, btw)) team be driving for a winning field goal. kudos on the win, and stopping manning, all day, but especially that last drive.
And it’s not even a matter of not being used to losing. it’s more a matter of being used to beating bad teams.
go back to your blog and celebrate your Mini-Superbowl and what i’ve heard called the biggest win the Eagles have had in years.
"We'll put em in the pot, shake it up and see what comes out." - Howard Mudd
"Nothing's complicated if you understand it." - Tom Moore
"It always takes longer than you expect, even when you take into account Hofstadter's Law." - Hofstadter's Law
Dallas Clark is
Just. This. Incredible.
it’s more a matter of being used to beating bad teams.
which would be great if you failed to a bad team.. I would be just as whiny as you are, and pissed, and annoyed..
but you were beaten (soundly OR not..still beaten) by a good team. So no reason to whine. Shake it off and move on..
btw, the bengals are a bad team.. enjoy the “W”
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