Why the Donovan McNabb trade was so stupid
by Brad Wells on Apr 7, 2010 12:31 PM EDT
in Colts Analysis
Email
Print
If you take the Donovan McNabb trade at face value, the message sent from the Philadelphia Eagles to their season ticket holders is that 2010 is a rebuilding year; that the Eagles are not Super bowl contenders, and any notion of them going to the Super Bowl and winning it is a pipe dream fantasy.
Now, the Eagles themselves will take issue with this, but their words on the subject offer nothing of real value. Old saying: Actions > Words. And when you trade the player your entire team is built around for a couple of draft picks... yeah, you're rebuilding. Telling me anything else implies that you think I'm stupid.
So, Eagles fans, maybe you should petition the team to get some kind of refund on your season tickets. That, or you can scalp the hell out of them to Cowboys, Giants, and (ha!) Redskins fans when they show up in Philly during the regular season. I mean, it's only fair that if the Eagles are going to rip you off that you return the favor. I highly doubt you had Kevin Kolb in mind as the unquestioned starting QB heading into the 2010 season when you forked over a grand for the right to watch the Eagles play.
What's that? McNabb was done and Andy Reid is cutting his loses before his QB fully declines?
Um, yeah. Right.
Donovan McNabb is 33 years old. He threw 22 TDs and only 10 INTs in 2009, helping the Eagles to an 11-5 record despite some truly devastating injuries to Brian Westbrook and the offensive line late in the season. He also averaged 8 yards a completion, the highest for him since 2006. So, no offense, but if Donovan McNabb suddenly sucks now, so does Joe Flacco, Carson Palmer, and Eli Manning. Hell, Kurt Warner, who retired this past season despite the Cardinals wanting him to stay, had a 93.2 QB rating in 2009. And while people like to make note that McNabb is injury prone and takes a lot of shot because he's mobile, nobody took more shots and was more injury prone than Kurt Warner, save maybe Ben Roethlisberger. Last I checked, no one was looking to trade away those two guys last season
Well, maybe if Ben is convicted of assault the Steelers will look to trade him to Oakland, but that's a different topic.
So no, this notion that McNabb all of a sudden sucks and the Eagles cut their losses before he really declined is just a load of bird poop.
The latest excuse I've heard for why McNabb was traded is quite possibly the most laughable of the bunch. After the jump, I'll show you just how LOL it is and how, when you compare it to the Colts of 2009, it's about as pathetic an excuse as anything we've ever heard from Andy Reid, and that's saying something. Reid's now-legendary post-game mumbles about how he f*cked up the clock management for certain games sets the standard for worthless excuse making by an NFL head coach with waaaaaaay too much job security.
The latest excuse for trading McNabb is brought to us by Gregg Rosenthal of PFT. Now, I'm not bashing Gregg. He is just trying to connect the dots based on some comments made by DeSean Jackson. Here's Rosenthal, emphasis mine:
"It was time for a change," said Jackson according to the Philadelphia Daily News. "We've got some young players here. I'm just excited about everything."
Jackson's radio buddies gave him a chance to retract the words. He didn't back down:
"At the end of the day, I'm not the owner. Obviously, that's not just my opinion. [But] I'm not going to get caught up in saying . . . whatever."
Were Jackson's transparent feeling a major factor in the deal? We highly doubt it. But the Eagles wanted their young skill players to develop as one. It looks like Jackson felt the same way, and that couldn't happen with Kevin Kolb on the bench.
Again, this is a logical assumption by Rosenthal, based on all we have seen, heard, and talked about regarding McNabb. So, this next bit is not me bashing Gregg's conclusion. It is me bashing the Eagles if this is, indeed, their reasoning for trading McNabb:
What a bunch of f*cking morons.
Flashback with me, if you will. Look at the start of the 2009 season for the Indianapolis Colts. Gone was Marvin Harrison. Anthony Gonzalez went down in a heap in Week One. Running game getting rebuilt. Offensive line in a state of change.
Yet, despite all the new, young players on the roster at the skill positions, like Donald Brown, Austin Collie, and Pierre Garcon, the Colts managed to chug along as they always do, winning 14 straight games to start the season, and playing in Super Bowl 44. Developing players like Garcon and Collie was a key force in propelling Indy to Miami in February.
And having an active hand in that development was Colts quarterback Peyton Manning, age 33 years old.
Now, the simple response is to say "McNabb isn't Peyton." I know. Of course he isn't. But, Donovan McNabb is a top ten QB. Yes, he is. I'm not going to even acknowledge anyone suggesting otherwise. I won't put people like Matt Schaub or Tony Romo ahead of McNabb. I'm also not 100% certain that even Aaron Rodgers is better. Guys like Peyton, Tom Brady, Philip Rivers, Eli Manning, Brett Favre, and Drew Brees are clearly better than him. So, at best, He's a between 7 and 10, and when you are in that range you are an elite-level player in the NFL.
That established, we've seen players like Brent Celek, DeSean Jackson, Jeremy Maclin, and LeSean McCoy blossom with McNabb as their QB. Why, in God's name, would you throw a monkey wrench in that development? Because Kevin Kolb is the same relative age as Jackson, McCoy, and Maclin? Does that make any friggin sense?
We've seen Peyton develop Collie, Austin, and (at one point) Reggie Wayne. We've seen Roethlisberger turn Santonio Holmes into a Super Bowl hero. We've seen Tom Brady take a no-name scrub in Miami (Wes Welker) and develop him into Brandon Stokley on the Super Soldier Serum. Are the Eagles actually thinking that Donovan McNabb cannot help in the development of their young skills position players? I mean, these are the caliber of players that McNabb has NEVER HAD at any point in his long career in Philly. Why would he not want to make them better?
Gregg's conclusion makes sense given the info the Eagles are feeding us, but if you take a step back and look at the picture, the excuses are nothing more than an illogical mish-mash of crap. The real reason Donovan McNabb was traded had to do with one word:
Money.
Prior to the trade, Kevin Kolb made it known to the Philly brass that he would not negotiate a new contract with them unless he was guaranteed the starting job in 2010.
Stop right there.
Think about that for a second.
Some back-up QB who has proven absolutely nothing in this league, and was a reach pick in 2007, is walking into Joe Banner's office and telling him "Make me a starter or I'll bolt." Rather than laugh in the schmuck's face and tell him to get out before they call security, Joe Banner and Andy Reid reacted by trading Donovan McNabb... within the division, no less!
Seriously, can you think of no greater insult to McNabb and all that he has done to build a winner in Philly?
Kolb, with his career 4 TDs to 3 INTs, got the Eagles to boot McNabb by making his power play. This is the same Kevin Kolb that was drafted in the second round in 2007 after the Eagles traded out of the first round; the same Kevin Kolb that was picked ahead of players like Zach Miller, Sydney Rice, LaMarr Woodley, Eric Weddle, and Steve Smith. You know, guys that might have helped Donovan McNabb and the Eagles win a Super Bowl. Instead, they took Kolb, who has done nothing but imitate Jim Sorgi the last three years. Now, in order to justify that pick and prevent Kolb from bolting to another team, they traded McNabb.
Obviously, Andy Reid and the Philly brass certainly do not have the stones to tell this to Eagles season tickets holders. This is because Reid and his crew are nothing more than spineless buffoons with zero accountability for their consistently stupid moves. But yeah, that's the reason why McNabb was traded. It wasn't because McNabb's skills are significantly declining. It wasn't because they wanted all their young players to develop with other young players. It was because Reid and his crew screwed up the 2007 Draft, and now the sacrificial lamb for that botched move is Donovan McNabb.
So, again, if you have season tickets Eagles fans, scalp the hell out of those things. You were totally screwed over by the morons running your team. Return the favor.
82 comments
|
2 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Lets face it, you probably can’t win the SB, if your QB completes only 60% of his passes. McNabb was 20th in completion percentage. It was a great decision, to trade him. Kolb may throw more INTs his first years as a starter, but he showed, he has more potential, than McNabb.
by Ty46 on Apr 7, 2010 12:54 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
And for a moment and just for entertaining purposes
Imagine that Kolb actually turns out to be a nice QB. The Eagles make the playoffs and McNabb sucks in Washington (which he will). Eagles management will laugh to death.
"We’re only going to score 17 points? haha...OK" - Tom Brady
Leonard: "Sheldon, why is this letter in the trash?"
Sheldon: "Well, there's always the possibility that a trash can spontaneously formed around the letter, but Occam's Razor would suggest that someone threw it out."
Last piece of Colts merch added to my collection: iPod Touch skin.
You touch on something important here
A 33 year-old QB who completes only 60% of his passes is probably never going to improve dramatically in that regard. What McNabb did well was get the ball downfield; what he did poorly was the intermediate cross and slant routes. I have not seen Kolb play much, but my understanding is that his accuracy on those routes is far superior to McNabb’s. Kolb may actually be a much better fit for the Eagles’ version of the West Coast offense than McNabb was. When you factor in McNabb’s age, injury history, salary, and contract status, I can see why they let him go. I’m surprised to see him traded to a divsion rival, but not surprised that the Eagles believe Kolb to be a better long-term solution. And it’s always better to trade a player a year too early rather than a year too late.
Nothing's complicated if you understand it.
Don't they have guys now in Jackson and Maclin who are talented deep threats?
And ergo, shouldn’t they keep the guy who can throw the deep ball? I’m not saying Kolb is worthless or anything, but you don’t find many guys available who have been to that many high profile playoff games and won that many football games at the QB position, only to get flipped for a couple draft picks (and not even a 1st round pick). If they lost Kolb and get 4 more years of McNabb, are they really worse off? I don’t think so, personally.
Almost put in my original post
that I actually think Jackson is better off with Kolb. Judging by his comments he obviously prefers Kolb, which doesn’t mean everything of course, but I tend to put a lot of stock in which QB a receiver prefers to have throwing to him. After all, he may or may not be a genius, but I’m sure he knows better than any of us who he feels more comfortable with and who can make him the most money.
Jackson is a deep threat because he has great speed, but I personally think he’s better utilized by getting him the ball in open space on an intermediate level rather than just sending him on fly patterns every down, and Kolb is better for him in that regard. In the two games Kolb started last year, Jackson had 10 catches for 250 yards and 2 TDs — a 71 yd TD and a 64 yd TD. Somehow I don’t think Jackson’s “deep threat” abilities will be underutilized with Kolb at QB. I don’t know a lot about Maclin, but I’ve seen supposed deep threats flourish in the West Coast offense many times before, I don’t know why Maclin couldn’t.
Nothing's complicated if you understand it.
exactly
McNabb’s arm is better deep than Kolb’s, but really, in the NFL, how often is someone open super deep at the same time there’s good protection? Jackson is shifty and good in space. It might mean 2 or 3 fewer long bomb highlight plays per year, but there’s also plenty of opportunity for 10-15 more plays he can break too. Wouldn’t surprise me one bit to see him have a much better year next season.
Mock drafts are stupid and pointless.
Fair points.
I acknowledge them, although if you can beat guys on fly patterns and your QB can get you the ball running them, it behooves you to run them, doesn’t it?
You stop it with your logic!
BBS will not acknowledge you!
That’s really what it comes down to. Though I do agree with LTTelamon below… they got a weapon who really plays to McNabb’s strengths. Then they got rid of him.
McNabb was never the right guy for that particular offense. The fact that they stuck with that offense for so long instead of tailoring it to suit him more was, to me, much much dumber than trading him.
I don’t see either team getting any better from this trade. I don’t see the Eagles falling off a cliff, but they’re not going to be any better.
(Unrelated: FWIW, McNabb was 20th in DVOA last year. Suggesting that you’re not sure Aaron Rodgers is better is laughable. And yes, this last year, Palmer and Eli did suck. And Flacco, for all the hype he gets as a 2nd year player, still isn’t anything special.)
Mock drafts are stupid and pointless.
You touch on something important here
The facts are, Donovan has a 92.9% passer rating & 65% win percentage. What he did well was rebuild a faltering franchise and win championships for a team who hadn’t won since the 60’s. Whatever the reasons he’s been traded, Don is a class act and I’ll be cheering for the burgandy, gold & white in 2010/2011. GO REDSKINS!!!!!!!!!!!
Kevin Kolb = Aaron Rodgers
"Not stoppin' there, that's not in store. Push it to the limit, we want more."
-Gordon Hayward a.k.a. G-Time
I agree
The Kolb and Rodgers parallel could be a strong one, making post-McNabb Eagles pretty damn good. I don;t see it as necessarily a rebuilding year, and so what if they rebuild and still manage 8-8? That’s pretty good. Better than Indy’s back to back 3-13 rebuilding years… which are pretty far back in the rear view mirror today. if they go 8-8 as rebuilders in a tough division, then 11-5 and the playoffs the next year is not far-fetched at all.
And this comes from a HUGE McNabb fan.
I hate Joe Namath. That's how long I've been a Colts fan.
Doesn't mean McNabb is Favre.
The difference in the Packers scenario is that if the Packers did not retain Rodgers, Favre could have retired at the drop of a hat (as he had suggested he might do) and left the franchise with literally nothing to field at the position. McNabb is still talented, and by all reports I’ve read would have still been willing to play for the franchise if they had committed to him? I really don’t see a corollary here to that situation – how do the Eagles lose if they keep McNabb? They’re out a QB with potential, but they already have a top 10 guy who could have played 4 more years, plenty of time to find another talented QB. This move confuses the hell out of me.
uh, no
I’m semi in favor of the trade, but Kolb doesn’t have nearly the tools that Rodgers has.
He’ll be more accurate than McNabb on a lot of routes but less effective on several others. The trade is really only good because he’s younger. He’s not a star in the making.
Mock drafts are stupid and pointless.
re: Rodgers v. Kolb
Thank you – I would have sounded too much like a Cal homer if I tried to respond to that remark!
How can you not love a team that does this?
You already do.
"I am in favor of censorship ‐ not against what is supposed to be sexy or dirty, but against what is idiotic." -Jean Renoir
Random fact of the week from the empty void that is my mind: That sucked.
Kolb comparison is not a good one
Kevin Kolb is in no way, shape, form or fashion Aaron Rodgers. Two completely diferent QB’s from a physical skill set.
Kolb, who has only played two complete games, is the classic West Coast QB with the great underneath acurracy 15 yards and in. Kolb’s issues (the lack of velocity on his fast ball) will come to light when DC’s get the 3/4 games of fresh game film on him and force him to throw the football down the field. The ball simply does not come off his hands with zip beyond 15 yards and defenses will adjust accordingly.
Now Rodgers can play in any system and make all the throws. Rodgers has thrown for over 4000 yards in his two years as starter in GB and has successfully replaced a legend. Has Kolb done this! Rodgers posseses a cannon for an arm throwing with great velocity, touch , timing accuracy and anticipation. Rodgers is also strong in the pocket, durable and displays the great leadership intangibles that Kolb has yet to display ( Kolb didn’t beat out McNabb the Eagles management did).
Lets let a guy play a little before we anoint him the next___________fill in the blank.
Agree with the above posts. What really struck me was your claim that the Eagles have “built around” McNabb. Although he was their QB, and a capable one at that, I think the Eagles are a good example of a team in which no one is above the team and anyone can be replaced.
if anything
they’re not built around him at all. They have shoehorned an inaccurate QB into a system that demands accuracy for years, all while discouraging him from playing to his talents. Meanwhile, they surround him with no name skill players for the most part, and spend all their draft picks on linemen.
The drafting is smart, don’t get me wrong… but it doesn’t suit the idea that they’re building around McNabb. If they were building around him they wouldn’t run a west coast offense.
Mock drafts are stupid and pointless.
Philly is better team withOUT Mcnabb
unloading mcnabb should have been priority one this year… kolb fits the west coast system better.. i believe i read somewhere that the philly players (especially WRs) supported kolb over mcnabb.. he throws a more precise ball.. GREAT move by philly… if philly thought that highly of mcnabbs abilities i doubt they’d have traded him to DC.. Kolb with be a hot commodity come FFL draft
Wes Welker was a No Name Scrub?
I beg to differ. I hated the trade then and still do. Welker was Miami’s best receiver the year before a trade on a team with no receivers. That trade within the division was moronic for them and strengthened the division rival pats considerably. You may not remember Welker the year before but he WAS not a scrub on that crappy Miami team that year.
Consider yourselves very lucky then.
"I am in favor of censorship ‐ not against what is supposed to be sexy or dirty, but against what is idiotic." -Jean Renoir
Random fact of the week from the empty void that is my mind: That sucked.
Either way.
"I am in favor of censorship ‐ not against what is supposed to be sexy or dirty, but against what is idiotic." -Jean Renoir
Random fact of the week from the empty void that is my mind: That sucked.
Not to make waves
But I am in complete disagreement with you on this BBS. I don’t think the Eagles are at all showing that this is a rebuilding year. I admit, I’m surprised that they traded McNabb, and that they traded him to a division rival, but to do that I think shows they have much more confidence in Kevin Kolb than anything else. Has Kolb been great? No. But with McNabb being consistently injured (I should know, I picked the guy multiple years in a row in FF), he’s gotten a good amount of experience under his belt. They had three potential starting QB’s, they had to get rid of somebody, might as well keep the young guy who’s shown promise.
As for Reid and Co., and their “buffoonery”, not totally sure where that’s coming from. I can’t speak for the draft and front-office moves because I don’t pay that much attention to the Eagles from that vantage point, but I can safely say that Andy Reid stuck by Donavan McNabb for much, much longer than even a good number of Eagles fans wanted him to. As a result, they were the NFC’s most consistent producer in the playoffs. I mean, what the Colts have been in the regular season, the Eagles have been almost as good and consistent in the playoffs (until recently, of course).
I also find it difficult to think that just because a team turns to its younger players, that it automatically means they aren’t looking towards the Super Bowl. Just look at the Jets last year: Sanchez (Rookie QB); Shonn Greene (Rookie RB), and they had an honest shot at the Super Bowl.
The Eagles may not necessarily be better off without McNabb, but I seriously doubt they will be worse off.
Eli Manning is clearly better than Donovan McNabb?
Are you fucking kidding?
by peytonsurdaddy on Apr 7, 2010 2:16 PM EDT reply actions 3 recs
This
"Not stoppin' there, that's not in store. Push it to the limit, we want more."
-Gordon Hayward a.k.a. G-Time
Eli's only Top 10 year was 2008
He had a dominant offensive line and running game that year, along with Plax. When Plax shot himself, Eli started sucking, and completely f’ed up in the playoff game vs Philly. I have no clue how anyone could think he is a top 10 QB.
Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever.
Napoleon Bonaparte
Stampede Blue's Resident Steelers Fan
"[T]he Steelers have been evil pieces of crap for a long time who play dirty and seek to injure their opponents, and one day there will be a reckoning."
FriarBob
Can't you just feel the love?
Cornell University Class of 2014
by LV Steelers Fan on Apr 7, 2010 5:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Maybe just because his last name is "Manning"...
"We’re only going to score 17 points? haha...OK" - Tom Brady
Leonard: "Sheldon, why is this letter in the trash?"
Sheldon: "Well, there's always the possibility that a trash can spontaneously formed around the letter, but Occam's Razor would suggest that someone threw it out."
Last piece of Colts merch added to my collection: iPod Touch skin.
actually he was better in 2009
It just didn’t stand out as much because it still wasn’t that good and the rest of the team declined.
Mock drafts are stupid and pointless.
That seemed off to me too.
"I am in favor of censorship ‐ not against what is supposed to be sexy or dirty, but against what is idiotic." -Jean Renoir
Random fact of the week from the empty void that is my mind: That sucked.
It's BBS, what do you expect?
Insert Clever Statement Here
And I take anything that Desean Jackass says with a grain of salt.
As an example of his poor judgment I present Exhibit A. What should have been his first touchdown as a rookie in the NFL instead earns him a spot as the biggest Monday Night Football jackass of all time.
I remember that.
It. Was. Great.
"I throw, you catch. It's NOT that hard!"
Peyton Manning, SNL, 2007
by peytonsthebest on Apr 7, 2010 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions
I remember that.
That was hilarious.
"I am in favor of censorship ‐ not against what is supposed to be sexy or dirty, but against what is idiotic." -Jean Renoir
Random fact of the week from the empty void that is my mind: That sucked.
OMG!
Obviously not a huge Eagles fan, but know a great QB when I see one, I watched that for the first time about a minute ago. I’m having trouble typing in between the laughter. Oh that is tooooo funny!!!! LOLOL… Yeah, I guess he’s the poster child for great reads on a situation. LOL
Now that I've stopped laughing...
You have to take notice how perfect the pass and the timing was to a ROOKIE!!! Dude put it in Jackson’s hands on the run. Desean didn’t have to make a single adjustment. C’mon folks! Recognize!
I find each comparison between McNabb and your Majesty Peyton Manning
in every one of the McNabb posts of yours insulting.
"We’re only going to score 17 points? haha...OK" - Tom Brady
Leonard: "Sheldon, why is this letter in the trash?"
Sheldon: "Well, there's always the possibility that a trash can spontaneously formed around the letter, but Occam's Razor would suggest that someone threw it out."
Last piece of Colts merch added to my collection: iPod Touch skin.
I should know by now not to read anything posted by BBS
but I guess I can’t help myself. This article is a joke. First, Kolb has shown a lot more promise than you give him credit for. Second, McNabb was going to be a free agent after the season and it is highly unlikely the Eagles would have re-signed him after the year was over. Getting a high second round pick and a future third/fourth is a pretty good deal. Maybe Kolb doesn’t work out, but I agree with some of the above posts that this resembles the Favre/Rodgers situation in Green Bay.
Promise doesn't win football games.
Performance does. McNabb has performed, and would have played for the Eagles if they would have offered him some sort of significant extension. I don’t think this situation is very similar to Favre/Rodgers, for reasons I discuss above. To me this trade is borderline ridiculous, but I guess if you don’t believe McNabb is a good quarterback, perhaps you might disagree. I guess to me his track record speaks for itself.
Track record
59% Completions in an offense that is primarily short passing.
I’ve stated above and elsewhere that this should be just as much a statement about the intelligence of the Eagles as about McNabb, but still. His track record is based mostly around the fact that the team, as a whole, has been very well built from top to bottom because it’s one of the better organizations. If we’re going to start pointing just to wins and championship appearances we might as well also just start calling Brady better than Manning.
Mock drafts are stupid and pointless.
by willyduer on Apr 7, 2010 7:19 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Two Things
1) Ben takes tons of hits, but he is certainly not injury-prone like Warner, McNabb, Polamalu, or Sanders. He didn’t miss a single game due to a football injury from 2006-2009(He didn’t play the 2006 opener due to an appendectomy). His only injury-riddled year was 2005(Missed 4 or 5 games).
2) Trading McNabb is in no way a sign that the Eagles are rebuilding. I say this as someone who has watched more Eagles games than Steelers games since I became a fan. Kolb is good, maybe not Rodgers-good, but still good. Philly will be right up there with Dallas on top of the NFC East, and I will be shocked if they miss more than a beat or two. They just have too much talent to be bad, and are one of the best drafting teams in the league(Last three first and second round picks: DeSean Jackson, LeSean McCoy, Jeremy Maclin).
Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever.
Napoleon Bonaparte
Stampede Blue's Resident Steelers Fan
"[T]he Steelers have been evil pieces of crap for a long time who play dirty and seek to injure their opponents, and one day there will be a reckoning."
FriarBob
Can't you just feel the love?
Cornell University Class of 2014
He said he takes a lot of shots
As in he does a lot of shots before he goes out on a rape spree.
"Not stoppin' there, that's not in store. Push it to the limit, we want more."
-Gordon Hayward a.k.a. G-Time
That was cheap and tasteless
There is nothing being said about rape except on PFT comment boards, and it’s not something one should joke about. Every time someone is accused of sexual assault, there is an instant rush to judgment, just like in the Duke lacrosse case. The script was so perfect for the MSM: privileged white boys rape desperately poor black girl. Of course, it was bogus and the erstwhile “victim” turned out to be a criminal in her own right. Fortunately, the court of public opinion carries no weight on the scales of justice.
Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever.
Napoleon Bonaparte
Stampede Blue's Resident Steelers Fan
"[T]he Steelers have been evil pieces of crap for a long time who play dirty and seek to injure their opponents, and one day there will be a reckoning."
FriarBob
Can't you just feel the love?
Cornell University Class of 2014
by LV Steelers Fan on Apr 7, 2010 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions
But in this case...
You have a privileged white boy who expects chicks to jump him because of what he does in life (he’s not even all that great looking) raping TWO middle-of-the-road (not desperate) white Women on different occasions. Bad comparison. We’ll just have to see how this shakes out…
You just proved my point
You act like there is no way he didn’t rape them, and that the charges are just a formality. That is why I made the Duke lax comparison, because people were so certain they were guilty due to lazy racial and economic stereotypes.
Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever.
Napoleon Bonaparte
Stampede Blue's Resident Steelers Fan
"[T]he Steelers have been evil pieces of crap for a long time who play dirty and seek to injure their opponents, and one day there will be a reckoning."
FriarBob
Can't you just feel the love?
Cornell University Class of 2014
by LV Steelers Fan on Apr 8, 2010 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions
I give Big Ben the benefit of the doubt
As LV Steelers Fan said, think of the Duke Lacrosse players.
I don’t think Big Ben did it.
Duke lacrosse
I don’t let facts get in the way of a good taunt of Duke.
"Not stoppin' there, that's not in store. Push it to the limit, we want more."
-Gordon Hayward a.k.a. G-Time
What's the extra OLOL stand for?
Or are you just laughing at offensive lines?
Anonymity breeds inhumanity. In simpler terms, don't be a troll.
I think the trade was a good one for the Eagles
Kolb has proven to be capable, and the Eagles got some draft picks for someone who – while obviously capable – could have walked away scot free next year or cost the organization a lot to re-sign when he was even older than today.
How can you not love a team that does this?
I'm sorry, but I agree with BBS mostly
1.) Trading a starting QB still at an elite level for what amounts to a crap draft pick and nothing else is a joke. You got nothing proven in return, no money, and a potential whiff on a draft pick for a top 7 QB in the NFL.
2.) Eli Manning couldn’t carry McNabb’s jockstrap, let alone be a better QB than McNabb. McNabb has carried his team literally from day one, and when given great WR’s (Owen’s in 2004, Jackson in 2010) McNabb had great years.
3.) Big Ben has had the benefit of a dominant run game, decent WR’s, and a stellar defense….. the practice squad WR’s for the Colts were generally better than anything the Eagles had in the last 10 years….save for Owens and the 2009-2010 roster..
McNabb has had to carry his team more than Big Ben has….and that unfortunately has made him do more and take more shots. Let’s face it, the last couple years without a running game Big Ben has taken ALOT of hits and been hurt because of it.
4.) Trading within the division is an idiot move, and doing it for what the Eagles got in return was an even bigger screwup. You mean to tell me you couldnt even get at least 3 picks for McNabb ala Jay Cutler trade?
5.) The comparison of the Jets to the possibility of the Eagles is a horrible one. The Jets were a solid defensive team when they went 4-12, and still had a quality run game. This year, they had a good defensive minded coach, the league’s best run game, and the league’s best defense. With a rookie QB, the mix was just right. Look at Atlanta and Baltimore last year, it can happen. The Eagles DONT have that. They have a mediocre running attack, and they just tossed their most potent but injury prone RB to the curb. They have an average defense that lost their commander last year (Jim Johnson RIP). This is not a team that will surprise anyone, not with the Giants and Cowboys being solid and the Redskins looking better by the minute.
6.) Kevin Kolb is a very talented QB. He came in on a moments notice in week 2 and threw for almost 500 yards against the Saints. He had decent stats in the games he played in. However, this is an exact duplicate of the 2009 season with Matt Cassell. Unproven guy all of a sudden commands top 5 QB money. It happened a few years ago with Matt Schaub.
Look, the kid can play, but can he be an elite QB? Can he replace what McNabb provided that offense with? Right now, no he cannot. I won’t say the Eagles are worse off with him at the QB position, but do you trade away the guy who has carried you every year for someone unproven? I can’t see you making that choice. You trade him to a team that needs him. There are some very good QB’s in even this draft that you could grab to replace McNabb for far less.
Even without McNabb in Philly, there is still zero guarantee that Kolb signs an extension. He could play great this year, and get a mega deal next year from someone else as a free agent.
by DevilsReject on Apr 7, 2010 4:33 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
The Steelers haven't had a dominant offensive line OR running game since 2005
How many Steelers games have you watched since then?
Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever.
Napoleon Bonaparte
Stampede Blue's Resident Steelers Fan
"[T]he Steelers have been evil pieces of crap for a long time who play dirty and seek to injure their opponents, and one day there will be a reckoning."
FriarBob
Can't you just feel the love?
Cornell University Class of 2014
by LV Steelers Fan on Apr 7, 2010 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Obviously not many.
"I am in favor of censorship ‐ not against what is supposed to be sexy or dirty, but against what is idiotic." -Jean Renoir
Random fact of the week from the empty void that is my mind: That sucked.
Probably just the Steelers-Colts game in 2008
In which the Steelers O-Line and running game was anything but dominant. >:-(
Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever.
Napoleon Bonaparte
Stampede Blue's Resident Steelers Fan
"[T]he Steelers have been evil pieces of crap for a long time who play dirty and seek to injure their opponents, and one day there will be a reckoning."
FriarBob
Can't you just feel the love?
Cornell University Class of 2014
by LV Steelers Fan on Apr 7, 2010 6:15 PM EDT up reply actions
That was such a great game.
"I am in favor of censorship ‐ not against what is supposed to be sexy or dirty, but against what is idiotic." -Jean Renoir
Random fact of the week from the empty void that is my mind: That sucked.
It would have been greater had Dallas Baker not been a total waste of space on the final play
HE WAS IN THE PERFECT POSITION!
Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever.
Napoleon Bonaparte
Stampede Blue's Resident Steelers Fan
"[T]he Steelers have been evil pieces of crap for a long time who play dirty and seek to injure their opponents, and one day there will be a reckoning."
FriarBob
Can't you just feel the love?
Cornell University Class of 2014
by LV Steelers Fan on Apr 8, 2010 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions
Too bad.
"I am in favor of censorship ‐ not against what is supposed to be sexy or dirty, but against what is idiotic." -Jean Renoir
Random fact of the week from the empty void that is my mind: That sucked.
It's OK
That was the game that turned our season around. We only lost once after that! :-)
Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever.
Napoleon Bonaparte
Stampede Blue's Resident Steelers Fan
"[T]he Steelers have been evil pieces of crap for a long time who play dirty and seek to injure their opponents, and one day there will be a reckoning."
FriarBob
Can't you just feel the love?
Cornell University Class of 2014
by LV Steelers Fan on Apr 8, 2010 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions
That was a memorable loss too.
"I am in favor of censorship ‐ not against what is supposed to be sexy or dirty, but against what is idiotic." -Jean Renoir
Random fact of the week from the empty void that is my mind: That sucked.
And one that also proved to be a blessing in disguise
We got to host the softie Chargers(who had beaten the Colts one week earlier) while Baltimore and Tennessee beat the tar out of each other. We would have beaten either one, and we just so happened to get the Ravens. Had we been the 1 seed, we would have faced the fresher Ravens in the divisional round and the relatively unscathed Titans in the AFCCG.
Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever.
Napoleon Bonaparte
Stampede Blue's Resident Steelers Fan
"[T]he Steelers have been evil pieces of crap for a long time who play dirty and seek to injure their opponents, and one day there will be a reckoning."
FriarBob
Can't you just feel the love?
Cornell University Class of 2014
by LV Steelers Fan on Apr 8, 2010 6:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Assuming that the Titans would have beaten
the Chargers.
"I am in favor of censorship ‐ not against what is supposed to be sexy or dirty, but against what is idiotic." -Jean Renoir
Random fact of the week from the empty void that is my mind: That sucked.
I'd say that's a safe bet
The Colts were unable to exploit SD’s terrible run defense, hence the reason for their loss.
Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever.
Napoleon Bonaparte
Stampede Blue's Resident Steelers Fan
"[T]he Steelers have been evil pieces of crap for a long time who play dirty and seek to injure their opponents, and one day there will be a reckoning."
FriarBob
Can't you just feel the love?
Cornell University Class of 2014
by LV Steelers Fan on Apr 8, 2010 6:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Compared to what the Eagles had...
It was quite dominant….
Ever since 2005 the Steelers have become more pass oriented as they had a QB who was able to really throw the ball as well as make big plays by moving around. Sure, they’ve had losses on the O-Line and the running attack hasnt been great…..but its still been a team that generally averaged 100 ypg…
The Eagles rarely had a RB ever post a 100 ypg stat…..and usually that was on the end of a blow out…
because they don't ever call running plays!
They’re a short passing offense. As pass-heavy as any team in the last decade. They used to have games where they’d go 70-30 pass to run.
Frankly, I’ve never thought much of Reid. He has a QB who throws backfield passes that hit his receiver in the feet. They’re Russell and VY-esque. He completes only 59% of his generally very easy passes. He’s also fat and out of shape and becoming a bit more fragile. His fans hate him, he hates them back, and he has never played well under even a remote amount of pressure. He used to be great under pressure, back when he was in shape and allowed to run, but they discouraged that and now he can’t fall back on one of his strengths. Sure, he’s only 33, but there’s no reason not to expect him to age very quickly, given his physical makeup and skill set. Meanwhile, the Eagles had a capable backup that would not have re-signed if McNabb was re-signed (not a powerplay – a simple statement of fact. Would you sign long term to be a backup when others would let you try to start? It’s a no-brainer.) Therefore, they took the absolute best package of picks available. It came from a division rival, but given that that rival has huge gaping holes, there’s no reason to care about that. They guaranteed themselves an extra prime time game next year, and that’s really the only side effect of trading him within the division.
Mock drafts are stupid and pointless.
No way
The Eagles have had a much better O-Line since 2005, and the rushing games have been relatively even in total yardage DESPITE the fact that Philly has been a much more pass-happy team in the past few years. Proof:
2006: PIT-4.24 YPR, PHI-4.77
2007: PIT-4.24, PHI-4.69
2008: PIT-3.68, PHI-3.99
2009: PIT-4.17, PHI-4.30
If the Eagles wanted to have more rushing yards, they would run the ball more. With the exception of 2008, Philly has been very efficient on the ground.
Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever.
Napoleon Bonaparte
Stampede Blue's Resident Steelers Fan
"[T]he Steelers have been evil pieces of crap for a long time who play dirty and seek to injure their opponents, and one day there will be a reckoning."
FriarBob
Can't you just feel the love?
Cornell University Class of 2014
by LV Steelers Fan on Apr 7, 2010 8:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Again (as in the first time you posted on this), BBS...
…I don’t disagree with your conclusions, but you’re calling Andy Reid to task for this, and indications are and have been that Reid wasn’t behind the decision. Obviously, he didn’t lay his job on the line to fight it if he was against it, but for the time being, can’t we at least lay the blame on the owner and the Eagles front office where it rightfully belongs?
Super Soldier Serum
I’m really liking the Captain America reference
by FreeneyWillEatYourBaby on Apr 7, 2010 5:46 PM EDT reply actions
I agree with BBS
You don’t trade franchise QB’s. This is a QB league. This trade was idiotic and I hope the Philly fans get what they deserve…a decade of losing seasons for running McNabb out of town. Andy Reid goes full retard in his playcalling half the time and that is McNabb’s fault??
I hope the Skins kick the Iggle’s asses this season.
Couldn't agree more
Reid is one of the overrated coaches in the league and Kolb will be lucky to have a career as good as the one McNabb has had in Philadelphia.
Nice job BBS and rec’d.
I also agree with this
I’m not knocking kolbs skills but proven?? Pfft He played “good” against a suspect NO defense (how many interceptions?) and great against a last placed Kansas City defense. Thats not saying much. If having a good game against a suspect defense counts than J Russell looked good against the eagles…? The difference between Donovan and these other guys are the facts that A)Other teams have a running game. They might not have a top notch running game, but atleast they do hand the ball off. The eagles offense is too predictable. Everyone knows they r going to pass. I mean, why are you throwing the ball on 3rd and 2? B) Like earlier stated, adapt the offense to his strengths. Hes supposed to be your franchise quarterback. ……well help him out. With what he had to work with im amazed he did as well as he has. Everyone is upset about the eagles not reaching the bowl last year and they put it on his shoulders. Last time I checked he wasnt a part of a defense that got used and abused way too much this season. He may not have been the most accurate passer, but he shouldn’t be passing all the time anyway. Call some run plays and give the man a break. I think he will do well in washington because they have a great backfield, and a head coach that gives a damn.
P.S. Jackson will see his lions share of double coverage, and he isnt built to go across the middle. $5 says Maclin has a more productive year.
recd
Non Sibi Sed Patriae.
I love my ZX-6r Kawasaki.....159 mph is my top speed..will top that this spring
I bleed Scarlet and Grey...A Buckeye for Life
(formerly mathew.40)
Not a bad trade
I think the Eagles already knew that in 1-2 years or so that McNabb was going to retire. I don’t think McNabb is one of those guys that wants to play until he’s Favre’s age. He’s also no Peyton, but he’s much better than Campbell. And when I saw Kolb step in when McNabb went out he actually did as good or better than McNabb. Kolb was no big name in the draft. But neither was Tom Brady. And neither was Matt Cassell. Kolb shows the potential. And if you’re going to lose McNabb in a year or two anyway and go to Kolb, why not get rid of McNabb while you can still get some good trades out of him and use those trades to beef up the weak spots in your team and give the promising rooking some play time to develop him before he gets too old and at the same time give him some better players to work with. I think it was a good trade for both teams. Philly had a couple good quarterbacks to fall back on and Washington needed a better one with some experience. The team I’d really keep my eyes on though is Kansas City. I see them making a ton of great moves this offseason. The new offensive and defensive coordinators, the new center, etc. Look for Kansas City to start improving dramatically.
by ColtsFanInEnemyTerritory on Apr 8, 2010 10:07 AM EDT reply actions
Kolb and Conan BFFs
Looks like Kolb was smoking the same crap that Conan O’Brien was when he demanded Jay’s job five years ago even though Jay was #1 in his industry. Donovan is definitely a top 10 and arguably top 5 (I love the Giants, but Eli is not better than McNabb… sorry). And I don’t see Phillip Rivers consistently being better either. So with all of that being said, it will be interesting to see if the Eagles will find themselves halfway through the season in the same position as NBC did a few months ago. Of course, they don’t have NBC balls, so they won’t fall on the sword and beg Donovan to come back, but I’m sure they will be wishing they had the cahonas.
Kolb has never had the “privilege” of playing against a top-rated defense. If I could have my dithers (and they do normally match up with 2 or 3 AFC teams in regular season play), the Eagles would play the Colts in an early season matchup (not preseason). Then we can watch the bookends- Dwight Freeney and Robert Mathis- light Kolb up like a Xmas tree and properly welcome him into his role that he is oh-so-ready for. That would actually make my year at this point. Kolb and the Eagles management deserve it.
by KP88 on Apr 8, 2010 11:46 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Rec'd.
Any stating Kolb is proven needs to lay off the crack, imo.
"I throw, you catch. It's NOT that hard!"
Peyton Manning, SNL, 2007
by peytonsthebest on Apr 8, 2010 12:03 PM EDT up reply actions
You think McNabb is a Top 5 QB and better than Rivers
You, sir, should stick to a different sport.
Mock drafts are stupid and pointless.
Hold on a second...
“Donovan is definitely a top 10 and arguably top 5 (I love the Giants, but Eli is not better than McNabb… sorry). And I don’t see Phillip Rivers consistently being better either.”
Let’s take a look at Rivers for a second here:
YDS CMP% TD INT QB Rating
4254 65.2 28 9 104.4
Pretty good right? This is considering that he had the 31st rushing offense in the NFL and a mediocre to bad defense. As for the consistency argument, the guy went 22-6 in TD-Interceptions from week 6 (After the bye) through week 17 with a completion percentage of roughly 69%. Yeah, he’s inconsistent….
Now, let’s look at Eli Manning:
YDS CMP% TD INT QB Rating
4021 62.3 27 14 93.1
Not bad, but certainly not top 5 worthy. He had the 17th ranked running game that had 12 fumbles (Good for #3 in the NFL) with a defense that took a step back form elite to about average.
Let’s look at the topic of the thread, Donovan Mcnabb:
YDS CMP% TD INT QB Rating
3553 60.3 22 10 92.9
The most glaring thing here is the completion percentage, which is pretty below average. Considering that the top 5 teams have at least a 66% completion percentage (Philly is ranked 18th). Mcnabb as a top 5 QB doesn’t hold any water whatsoever.
In football, the object is for the quarterback, otherwise known as the field general, to be on target with his aerial assault, riddling the defense by hitting his recievers with deadly accuracy in spite of the blitz, even if he has to use the shotgun. With short bullet passes and long bombs, he marches his troops into enemy territory, balancing this aerial assault with a sustained ground attack that punches holes in the forward wall of the enemy's defensive line.
In baseball the object is to go home! And to be safe! "I hope I'll be safe at home!"
-George Carlin (RIP)
Completely agree with this post.
Bad move by Philly.
Lifelong Arizona Cardinals/Chicago Bears fan.
I can't stand fair-weather/bandwagon fans, stick with your team, throughout the good and the bad.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
