Andre Johnson thinks Reggie Wayne will show up to Colts training camp
by Brad Wells on Jun 14, 2010 11:35 AM EDT
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PrintWhen Paul Kuharsky is not giving Peyton Manning haters a savage beatdown, he's talking to Texans receiver Andre Johnson about Reggie Wayne.
They both played in college for Miami and live there for much of the offseason. Wayne’s working out at home more often, but the two have still spent time together, Johnson said."We talk about it; we’ve talked about it," Johnson said. "And we understand that it’s part of the business. That’s just part of it. It’s a violent game, probably the most physical game in the world. And it’s the most cut-throat game in the world. But we all understand that.
"I think he’ll be there [when the Colts open training camp]. I know Reggie; I know what kind of guy Reggie is and I’m pretty sure things will work out for him."
Like Andre Johnson, I too think that Reggie will show up for camp. However, if he doesn't, he should expect a fairly strong fan backlash. His botched route (which led to a pick six) in Super Bowl 44 had more to do with the Colts losing than Hank Baskett's muff on the onside kick that started the third quarter. So, for Reggie to demand more money now is very bad timing.
Camp opens August 1st at Anderson University.
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Brain Bleach!
Like Andre Johnson, I too think that Reggie will show up for camp. However, if he doesn’t, he should expect a fairly strong fan backlash.His botched route (which led to a pick six) in Super Bowl 44 had more to do with the Colts losing than Hank Baskett’s muff on the onside kick that started the third quarter. So, for Reggie to demand more money now is very bad timing.
Camp opens August 1st at Anderson University.
There….much better
Our heads may be bloody, but they are unbowed. We will be back next year better than ever!
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Okay, now I'm just sick of it.
Why is it that everyone thinks ONE PLAY lost us the game in the Super Bowl?
There were a BUNCH of things that cost us that game. Reggie made a mistake but his body of work has more than made up for it in my mind.
Oh yeah and either TAC or PTB (IIRC) posted this from Reggie’s Journal:
Now this mandatory thing called “mini camp”, that I felled to attend was
something I decided to do for this simple reason. I feel like I bust my butt
off for years and years. And of course so do many other players. But all I
have to say is for the last couple of years i have been receiving pay as
the 15th/16th ranked wide receiver in the NFL. People may have their own
opinion about my worth to the team or even if I’m ranked among the elite
receivers in the NFL. And that’s fine. I’m never going to argue your
opinion. All I have to say is go back to past and check my work and
compare. And we going to leave it at that. Totally a business move. Either
it works or it doesn’t. Screw it. Play ball.
I respect the hell out of the Jim Irsay, Bill Polian, Jim Calwell and the rest
of the coaches. I also have the upmost respect for the Colts Organization.
Truly a class act football team from front office on down. I have nothing
bad to say about them. Missing mini camp was totally out of my character
but this was a way to show everyone that I’m serious. Like I say it’s a
business move either it works or not. No hard feelings. I been receiving a
lot of emails saying “reggie don’t leave”. To answer that question, I’m not
going anywhere. I’m still under contract with the Colts and I don’t want to
go anywhere else. I want to retire a Colt even though that’s not up to me.
So I’ve been training like crazy. I have lost 15 plus pounds since the last
time you all have seen me. I’m not fully ready yet because I’m still
enjoying my offseason. But I will when the season starts. Let’s LET’S GO
COLTS!!!
Pretty sure he’ll be at Training Camp.
"Life's hard. It's supposed to be. If we didn't suffer, we'd never learn anything."
There were so many other factors that made the horse lose that superbowl…How about the colts pass rush?? Brees had all day to throw the ball and you cant say basketts terrible play on the onside really impacted everything..That possession is a tone setter and would of changed the whole game. By the time the pick six happened they were in desperate mode. You cant put all of the blame for reggie on that play. he was covered, manning and reggie can make that play but come on reggie was completely covered and manning still threw it hoping for reggie to make an incredible play on the ball manning knew reggie was injured and couldnt make that great of a cut on the ball but they were in desperate mode to make a play happen and thats what makes them so good because they take those chances.
the colts just got out played in the second half of that superbowl and I think this offseasons draft they added a few pieces like hughes that will make a difference this coming season.
I agree...
There were multiple factors leading to the Super Bowl loss. Even if the pick-six didn’t happen, there’s no guarantee that the Colts would have scored on that possession. Remember, they got the ball back after the pick-six and couldn’t score. Anyhow, the play with Reggie was a simple mistake, the one with Hank was just a boneheaded move. Everyone knows that you NEVER let go of the ball until the referee is trying to take it from you.
by TouchdownMonkey on Jun 14, 2010 1:48 PM EDT reply actions
And even then,
you fight the ref for the ball.
"I am in favor of censorship ‐ not against what is supposed to be sexy or dirty, but against what is idiotic." -Jean Renoir
Random fact of the week from the empty void that is my mind: The most common name in the world is Mohammed.
dont know you have funny in you Cass!
Kudos!!
If you see my smilieys, think of E.M.H. - our COLTs King of Smileys!
by Manning4ever on Jun 14, 2010 2:16 PM EDT up reply actions
there was one factor why we lost and its in my signature
Hank Baskett IS A WANKER
by ColtsUK on Jun 14, 2010 2:20 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
U must remember
Hank came from the Eagles./ Now I dont know what Eagles coaches teach, but Remember, McNabb didn;t know a game could end in a tie and it was that tie that let them in the playoffs.
Its a shame that Polian piclked him as he didn’t want another a receiver that hadn’t gone through training camp so he wouldn’t get injured. With all he played anyone else would have quickly got in condition, let alone some on the practice squad
Speaking of Polian, we took out starters starting with th Jet game to prevent injuries . MY QUESTION, with 2 minutes left and us way ahead Vs Jets in playoofs , why didnt we take out Freeney to prevent such a freak accident if we were so concerned anout injuries.
Please Read My 1st paragraph of profile to realize my multiple disabilities making it hard to type correctly if there are many typos etc
THIS is a good question
And i’ve wondered it myself. But for this one play, with… what?… 2 mins left? we might have been celebrating a second SB win.
Careful what you wish for... "A government big enough to give you everything you want is a government big enough to take from you everything you have." Gerald Ford, 38th US president
Yeah... that is my question too...
:(
If you see my smilieys, think of E.M.H. - our COLTs King of Smileys!
by Manning4ever on Jun 15, 2010 12:36 AM EDT up reply actions
Ask the coaches
Ask BB why he went for a 4th & 2. Ask Rex Ryan why the Jets came up short in the AFCCG. Ask Sean Payton why he went for an onside kick, the first of its kind before the 4th qtr. in a SB.
The answer would be unanimous – Peyton Manning.
The Colts’ fortunes swing on his arm more than anything else. We live and die by it, and when we have a running game or D to rely on consistently to control clock and tempo, we can do more than just what Manning can do for us.
Just adding relevance now...
The reason I am stating this in a Wayne thread is Manning would the first one to own up to his mistake on that INT or give credit to the defender, and in this case, Manning did give all the credit to Tracy Porter (though I still have a hard time believing how that staredown to Reggie happened like a rookie on Manning’s part). So, let us just give a pass to Reggie on this one considering the entire body of work.
thank you!
I love 18 as much as the next guy (note, i said guy… i’ll never feel about him the way M4, GF, and PTB do… i’m happy to report), but he’s not perfect. He had Collie (or was it Clark?) open over the middle on that same play. Peyton picks a different target, and things might have been very different.
Guess i’m just saying that i don’t blame Reggie, or even Baskett, for the loss; there were several reasons they didn’t win. Seems to me, the whole team was just a bit off that day.
Careful what you wish for... "A government big enough to give you everything you want is a government big enough to take from you everything you have." Gerald Ford, 38th US president
From whatI I remember
Collie had position, Peyton just disnt expect Wayne to pull up, then again, Wayne wasnt all there the play befor either and he should have said something or Peytion maybe should gave considered that, I just dont remember if Peyton had time to look elsewhere or was a rush / blitz approaching , Seems like he wanted a similar play as the one Wayne did to win Pats game
Please Read My 1st paragraph of profile to realize my multiple disabilities making it hard to type correctly if there are many typos etc
Peyton...
looked at two other receivers first.
Reggie blew the route.
Here’s a great article about it.
Wayne either slips or runs the wrong route or (in a less likely scenario) Peyton got the route wrong and threw it anyway. My money is on Wayne being at fault, that he simply ran a poor route. Instead of getting inside position on Porter (which should have been automatic for a guy as good as Wayne), Porter is able to jump the route and pick the ball off.
18to88.com
by deshawn zombie on Jun 14, 2010 4:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Agreed
No one’s perfect, but on that route (which they run several times a game), Reggie cut it off early for some reason and wasn’t in a position to catch the ball. It wasn’t really a great play by Porter either, he just had good position that looked even better since Reggie wasn’t where he was supposed to be. Right place at the right time.
I don’t blame the loss on that one play though. The Colts didn’t play to win the game in all phases.
I don't always drink beer....but when I do, I prefer Dos Equis.
Blame it on the defense who would have let up a game winning field goal anyway.
EVH+DLR=BFFs........ God I Hope So!!
^this
even if we score there, Brees marches and hits a time expiring FG (most likely). It was a team effort in a team loss. I’m over it already. 2nd place isn’t terrible.
Blogging about my summer at a Chinese law firm.
NEW BLOG, as my original one is blocked by the Great Firewall.
http://ajinshanghai.wordpress.com/
My guess would be Reggie never though he was going to get the ball in the first place. If you watch the video of the play, he kind of “went through the motions” as if he was just running a dummy route to occupy the corner and possibly the safety.
Either way, the entire play sucked and still haunts me to this day. God…
There's a new blog in town, the 12th HorseMan.
Collie and Clark
WERE NOT OPEN on that play.
Read the article and watch the frame by frame.
Both men were covered.
18to88.com
Why do I get the feeling
that we’re going to be having this discussion for another 30 years?
Cause we all felt we just let game slip away and were the better team , but to bad were injured
Please Read My 1st paragraph of profile to realize my multiple disabilities making it hard to type correctly if there are many typos etc
by bayone on Jun 14, 2010 5:38 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Well said, Bayone well said....
If you see my smilieys, think of E.M.H. - our COLTs King of Smileys!
by Manning4ever on Jun 15, 2010 12:40 AM EDT up reply actions
Take your word,
I thought I remembered the announcer saying that, Thanks
Please Read My 1st paragraph of profile to realize my multiple disabilities making it hard to type correctly if there are many typos etc
Are you sure, DZ?
When I look at the play (Here’s the video on YouTube), it looks like Collie is running free over the middle and could gain a first down while Clark has beat his man and could be led for TD.
Not trying to argue, dude… i respect your opinions. But that’s the way I see it.
Careful what you wish for... "A government big enough to give you everything you want is a government big enough to take from you everything you have." Gerald Ford, 38th US president
Yes, I'm sure.
When you watch the top angle, you can see that when Manning releases the ball, Collie is NOT past the first down sticks. There is a corner playing just behind him. Freeze the ball at the moment of release (:03 second mark). You see Collie one yard short of the first, and leaning TOWARD Manning. you see Porter and Wayne squared up.
If Manning throws to Collie instead of Wayne, that corner immediately closes in on Collie and hits him.
When you look at the stop motion, you see the safety over the top. That means Clark is double covered. If you throw to him, the safety takes him out. Again, freeze the live action at :03 and you see Clark is still covered in the slot.
Again, go to that article I linked to and watch the still frame shots from the QBs angle. You can see what Manning saw and why he went to Wayne.
Reggie just didn’t make the break.
18to88.com
by deshawn zombie on Jun 14, 2010 11:18 PM EDT up reply actions
You make a good point about having to evaluate coverage prior to the throw; not after
If i’m Manning, i have the most confidence in Wayne, on a play that’s worked well for us all season. And i’ll give you the point about Clark being well covered at the time the ball is thrown. As for Collie, yes he’s still in his cut and leaning away from the first-down marker… again… at the time the ball is thrown.
Here’s where i disagree. By the time the ball reaches the first-down marker, Collie has turned, is facing Manning, and is a yd beyond the sticks. First-down, no question, in my humble opinion. I’ll also point out that Manning was in no imminent danger; he could have waited another second for Collie to separate a bit more, and maybe even Clark to uncover.
So, i get your point… Manning made the call that had best succeeded in the past. I agree with you on that. But i still hold that:
- A throw to Collie probably would have resulted in a first
- A throw, leading Clark, probably would have resulted in a first, maybe a TD
- Had Manning waited another half-second to decide, he’d have seen that Porter wasn’t back-pedaling and that Wayne wasn’t the best option
Careful what you wish for... "A government big enough to give you everything you want is a government big enough to take from you everything you have." Gerald Ford, 38th US president
Cant wait for DZ to respond re: whether Peyton was in imminent danger ...
I still refused to watch the game again…. so i need the experts to tell me what actually transpired in this infamous play….
If you see my smilieys, think of E.M.H. - our COLTs King of Smileys!
by Manning4ever on Jun 15, 2010 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Peyton made the right call...
I think Peyton threw the ball in rhythm. Obviously, the best play would have been if he had had confidence in the line to pick up the blitz he could have run a pump and go with Wayne for a TD. As it was, CJ was having trouble with his man to the left and the blitz was coming to the right. It was third down, so Manning was going with what should have been the safest play.
Clark was not an option. There was safety help over the top. He was never open. He only looked open after the fact because guys left their zones once the ball was thrown.
Collie was not nearly as open as he looked. He’s running a crossing pattern short of the first down. I do not believe he gets the first.
Wayne ran a sloppy route for whatever reason. Maybe he didn’t expect the ball. Maybe he slipped. Maybe he ran the wrong route.
The point is that there was nothing wrong with the decision to throw to him. If he’s where he’s supposed to be that’s a completion. If there had been a fight for the ball/position, I could buy that it was a bad throw/decision or that Porter just jumped the route.
Wayne wasn’t close enough to the ball to even fight for it, and if you watch the way he ran the route, he was off balance and stumbling.
18to88.com
by deshawn zombie on Jun 15, 2010 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Ok. I'll concede to your wisdom
Not that knowing who was to blame helps us in any way. It’s still painful to watch that play.
Thanks, DZ.
Careful what you wish for... "A government big enough to give you everything you want is a government big enough to take from you everything you have." Gerald Ford, 38th US president
I'm pretty sure the million other catches that Reggie made
never helped us get to the Super Bowl. Any one could’ve made that catch in the New England game last year. I think I’ll go to training camp this year instead of Reggie.
Reggie has the right to do what is best for him. I will not be bashing him.
Semper ubi sub ubi!
by diagenesis on Jun 14, 2010 6:17 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
The attempts by some to make excuses for any mistake Manning makes has gotten absurd. The pick was Manning’s fault much more than Reggie’s fault. NFL.com’s Anatomy of a Play and their Playbook video covered it better than I could, but in summary:
- Austin Collie was open. The proof is in the videos I posted. Furthermore, with the deep safety recognizing the route, Clark and even Garcon were better options than Wayne. The article posted earlier never said anything about Collie not being open, and didn’t mention Clark or Garcon at all.
- Tracy Porter didn’t backpedal at all (“flat footed read” is the term used by Mayock), which should have tipped Manning off that Porter had anticipated the route.
- Manning stared at Wayne the whole play. No attempt to look off the corner at all.
- It isn’t mentioned in the above videos, but another NFL.com video shows that Colts had run the same play several times in that game, after running it frequently all season. Manning/Moore sometimes rely on the same plays too often, and it happened here.
- If Wayne ran the wrong route, why was the ball headed right to Wayne was? It would have hit Wayne in the chest if Porter didn’t intercept it.
- While receivers do have a responsibility to help prevent interceptions, placing more blame on the receiver for not breaking up a bad throw than on the QB for making that bad throw is silly.
Big play guys get the look when the game is on the line
Collie blew a route the possession prior to that and was still a rookie. Clark has shown the ability to drop the ball for unknown reasons. That route, when executed the way it is supposed to be, is nearly impossible to stop. It’s like the 49ers slant route in Tecmo Bowl.
I don't always drink beer....but when I do, I prefer Dos Equis.
you are crazy
Look at the tape. Collie had a man right there on him.
Manning clearly did not stare at Wayne the whole play. He looked at Clark and Collie. I don’t know what you are talking about.
The ball was headed to where Wayne was SUPPOSED to be. He was not there.
I don’t know what to tell you other we are clearly seeing vastly different things.
Wayne didn’t come out of his break. Manning and Porter knew where he was supposed to be. He just didn’t get there. Did he slip? Was his ankle bad from the injury? Did he blow the route? They won’t say.
18to88.com
by deshawn zombie on Jun 14, 2010 8:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Part of the problem is...
That what you don’t see in the full speed videos, that you do see in the frame by frame is things like Manning reading the safety over the top coming across to double Clark. It makes it look like Manning doesn’t look at him, but in effect, he can see the double coverage coming.
Collie ‘looks’ open, but he’s also not passed the sticks when the pass flies. There’s a LB right on him. If Manning tries to hit Collie, he gets smacked short of the first down.
Wayne was the best option. If he is where he is supposed to be, there is no possible way for Porter to make the pick. Go back and read the article and watch the stop motion.
18to88.com
by deshawn zombie on Jun 14, 2010 9:17 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't think he blew the route...
or at least it doesn’t appear that way watching the video. It looks like he stumbled a bit coming out of his cut for whatever reason. It could have been a slip or the ankle could have been bothering him like you mentioned above. Either way a stumble out of a cut almost certainly kills any chance of success for a successful completion in an offense that is built so much around timing.
Just my two cents but I think even with out the stumble it was going to be a fight for the ball with Porter. He made a good read and jumped it nicely.
"I found that if you have a goal, that you might not reach it. But if you don't have one, then you are never disappointed. And I gotta tell ya... it feels phenomenal."- Peter La Fleur
If he's where he's supposed to be...
Porter runs right into his back.
Your point is well taken though. There wasn’t a ‘fight’ for the ball’. Wayne wasn’t even close enough to Porter to lay a hand on him after the pick.
That screams out that it was Wayne’s error (for whatever reason…personally I think he stumbled).
18to88.com
by deshawn zombie on Jun 14, 2010 9:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Is it one of those Manning-haters talking?
trolls or not, sure doesn’t appreciate #18 much….. Those who don’t like Manning always can find tons of reasons to bash him. Truly believe history will tell…..
If you see my smilieys, think of E.M.H. - our COLTs King of Smileys!
by Manning4ever on Jun 15, 2010 12:44 AM EDT up reply actions
Collie was open but may or may not of got the first and Dallas had his guy beat if manning throws over the shoulder pass to dallas he has a first and them some. I dont know how anyone can say they were covered. this is the nfl guys arent going to be so wide open that no one will be around them. Collie had about a 4 yard cushion under neath after he broke to the inside and dallas had about 3 steps on his guy as well. peyton made the wrong throw
Freeze the shot
When Manning throws, Clark had zero steps AND a man coming over the top.
What play are you people looking at?
Clark looks open…AFTER the ball is released. Lots of guys look open after the ball is thrown in the NFL. At the time of the throw he is clearly covered.
18to88.com
by deshawn zombie on Jun 15, 2010 6:10 AM EDT up reply actions
It feels like some people are trying to go off of memory.
"I am in favor of censorship ‐ not against what is supposed to be sexy or dirty, but against what is idiotic." -Jean Renoir
Random fact of the week from the empty void that is my mind: The most common name in the world is Mohammed.
I am personally trying to completely forget
I still can’t think about that game
How can you not love a team that does this?
It really hasn't been all that bad reviewing this one play
the meds really help
Careful what you wish for... "A government big enough to give you everything you want is a government big enough to take from you everything you have." Gerald Ford, 38th US president
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