2010 Colts Preseason: One Final Guess By BBS For The Colts 2010 Active Roster
My first stab at guessing the 53-man roster was way back in June.
My second was the first week after training camp started.
My third was after the team had a couple of preseason games under their belt.
Now, with preseason concluded and cutdown day scheduled for tomorrow, I present my final guess as to the 2010 Indianapolis Colts 53-man roster... after the jump.
Please, be merciful.
OFFENSE
QB: Peyton Manning, Tom Brandstater
RB: Joseph Addai, Donald Brown, Mike Hart, Devin Moore
WR: Reggie Wayne, Pierre Garcon, Austin Collie, Anthony Gonzalez, Blair White
TE: Dallas Clark, Brody Eldridge, Jacob Tamme, Justin Snow
OT: Charlie Johnson, Ryan Diem, Tony Ugoh, Jeff Linkenbach, Unsigned Veteran
OG: Kyle DeVan, Jamey Richard, Mike Pollak, Jacques McClendon
OC: Jeff Saturday
Notes: Two weeks ago, I took some crap from some of you for having the Colts keep three quarterbacks. OK, I relent. Here I have them keeping just two, but notice that the sixth round pick from last year is missing. If I had to guess what the Colts will truly do, I'd say they'll keep both Curtis Painter and Tom Brandstater. Though, honestly, Painter has not earned a roster spot. And if the difference between keeping someone like Blair White or Ray Fisher is a scrub like Painter, then Painter should go. The rest of my offense is pretty intact, save dumping Brnadon James for Blair White. James' fumble against the Packers costs him a spot on the active roster. He's practice squad. Blair White has been excellent at receiver all preseason. He offers size at the position over players like Gonzo or Collie.
I left a 'Unsigned Veteran' on the o-line because I think the team will try and bolster that area due to the injuries along the line this preseason.

DEFENSE
DE: Dwight Freeney, Robert Mathis, John Chick, Jerry Hughes
DT: Daniel Muir, Antonio Johnson, Fili Moala, Eric Foster, Mitch King, Marlon Favorite
OLB: Clint Session, Philip Wheeler, Kavell Conner, Ramon Humber
ILB: Gary Brackett, Pat Angerer, Cody Glenn
CB: Jerraud Powers, Kelvin Hayden, Jacob Lacey, Deshea Townsend, Ray Fisher
FS: Antoine Bethea, Unsigned Veteran
SS: Bob Sanders, Melvin Bullitt
P: Pat McAfee
Notes: The only big change is Terrail Lambert getting dumped in exchange for Ray Fisher. Since the Buffalo Bills preseason game, Fisher has outplayed Lambert. Fisher also offers more on special teams as both a returner and a gunner. After Pat Angerer's outstanding preseason, he leap-frogs Glenn as the back-up MIKE. I still maintain the Colts will sign a veteran free safety, which is why that spot has the 'Unsigned Veteran' placeholder.

All in all, when I look at this roster I see a big boost to the special teams. Devin Moore, Ray Fisher, Pat Angerer, Jerry Hughes, and Mitch King will all add more speed and playmaking ability to kick returns and coverages. The receiving corps is just flat out amazing as is the overall defense. Excellent depth at all positions.
The weakness is the offensive line. Unless something dramatic happens, this is a weaker group than last season. This concerns me because the Colts will not win Super Bowl 45 with a weaker o-line than last year's. Remember, from here on out, it's Super Bowl or bust. Anything less than a another ring is a disappointment.
Overall, the players Bill Polian has brought in for Jim Caldwell to work with since March have been outstanding. However, the big concern is the offensive line. Though injuries in preseason have affected full and complete evaluation, it seems obvious to me that it was not improved despite it being the #1 priority area for improvement this off-season according to Bill Polian himself. I still question cutting Ryan Lilja and I still question why Charles Brown was passed on in the second round of the draft. Both players would provide significant upgrades to this offensive line regardless of the health of Jeff Saturday or Charlie Johnson.
Until I see this Colts o-line go out there and dominate a football game against a quality opponent, those questions will linger all season long. Don't ask me to 'get over it.' I'll 'get over it' when I see the Colts hoist another Lombardi trophy in Cowboys Stadium next February.
Regardless of my concerns about the o-line, the Colts have a damn fine football team for 2010. Obviously, I don't expect Jim Caldwell to follow this roster road map. He's a good coach and knows what will work and what won't. But, I think my guess for the final 53 is a good one. Hopefully, you agree. If you don't, discuss below.
Go Colts!
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I thought the same thing
Mitch King could be cut and re-signed to be on PS, IMO. He does not offer anything more than what Eric Foster offers, Larry Coyer does not keep too many tweeners around. But then, if Favorite is cut, Mitch King might be retained for special teams reasons that you specified, he could be a Darrell Reid like ST coverage guy for us.
If we are going to keep a 4th RB like Chad Simpson, he should be serviceable as an RB. I do not see Devin Moore or Brandon James serviceable as an RB. Devin Moore’s return skills were not used much yesterday primarily because the coaches were deciding between Brandon James and Ray Fisher. Javarris James is the most serviceable 4th RB while Devin Moore is the one that can get the most playing time as a 4th RB, as a return man.
I think Terrell Skinner might make the roster. He does not make many mistakes or miss many tackles. Again, Bethea is the most important safety for us – not Sanders, not Bullitt. Please God, please, let Bethea remain healthy all year.
Our secondary depth and O-line depth concerns me big time.
i disagree
Devin was the starting return guy. He has solidified a spot on the roster. The coaches were just trying to see what they have in Brandon James and Fisher b/c neither of them have played like they want a job until last night
"You play to win the game" -Herm Edwards
by TENACIOUSDB7 on Sep 3, 2010 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions
You may be right
I said this:
Devin Moore’s return skills were not used much yesterday primarily because the coaches were deciding between Brandon James and Ray Fisher
Upon looking back at it, I can see your point being a valid one. Devin Moore had already solidified his roster spot with his ball security. Remember when we cut Courtney Roby when he lost a fumble. With a QB capable of taking us 80 yards every single time, the Colts have never compromised ball security, IMO. It looks like the coaches may like what they see in Devin Moore. Ray Fisher will get the nod because he did not mess up while Terrail Lambert did, and he popped enough in the KR category thus making Giguere expendable there.
right about Bethea, wrong about Moore
Antoine has been our best safety for a couple years
Moore had the best rushing average of any of he backs in preseason, except for the rejuvenated Addai.
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
Can't rec this enough...
I don’t understand the King lovefest around here. Really. It makes no sense.
There’s a discrepancy between the player that most of SB wants Mitch King to be, and the player that Mitch King actually is. He has not looked dominant. He has not consistently generated pressure. He has not consistently done anything well. He’s been overpowered more often than not and looks terrible as a lead blocker, though that’s the coaches’ faults more than anyone for sticking to that dumb DT-as-FB idea.
I think Mitch King gets cut, and we’ll consequentially cue a lot of crying around here that really could be prevented if folks viewed his game objectively. He might be a hard-worker, but the fact is that he’s small for a DT and just as overpowered as Keyunta Dawson used to be at the position. There are better, more versatile options that will make the roster, specifically guys who can also line up at DE.
Thanks for being a rational voice on here when it comes to King, though.
by Collin McCollough on Sep 3, 2010 5:36 PM EDT up reply actions
And when King ISN'T cut but Marlon Favorite is
Who will be crying then?
by the_iowa_hawkeye on Sep 4, 2010 9:26 AM EDT up reply actions
I think you are close
Matthews over Favorite due to his ability to flex out to end and special teams ability. Painter over Brandstater because if they were even thinking about cutting Painter he would not have played into the 3rd quarter of last nights game. I also think we keep Brandon James, but that roster spot comes from the o-line because we ALWAYS keep 9 linemen…not 10. Either we get a veteran tackle or Jeff L….but not both.
I could also see Thomas over Pollak, but that is a close call to me.
yeppers - just 9 OL is traditional for the colts
that breakdown also seems overloaded at Linebacker — 6 is traditional. Did Cody Glenn even play last night? I think he’s a gonner. The backups will be Angerer, Conner, and Humber, IMHO.
for the record, for week 1 last year, we had on the roster:
3 QBs
3 RBs (only!)
4 WRs (only)
4 TE (Clark, Gijon, Tamme, Santi)
9 OL
9 OL (including a suspended Ed Johnson)
7 LB (Cody Glenn was signed right before gm 1, but then was relegated to PS; we had 6 LB most of the year)
4 S (not including Sanders on PUP)
6 CB
4 Specialists (Andrus was KOS but was cut before wk 2)
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
but he was on the 53-man roster for opening day
he was just inactive, along with 4 others to get down to 48 actives.
Federkeil, Devan, Fili, and Painter as emerg QB were also inactive that game I believe. It was tricky to track the math with Ed out and the last minute moves between the initial cut to 53, the assembly of the practice squad, and last minute acquisitions like Glenn and Aaron Francisco joining the roster before the first game.
The OL I recorded for that period were these 9:
SAT, CJ, DIEM, LILJA, POLLACK,UGOH, DEVAN, RICHARDS, FEDERKEIL
The PS had Jamie Thomas as well. Throughout the early and midseason, 2 of the nine would be inactive and they’d just roll with seven on gameday; later in the season, as injuries mounted, they took what they could get!
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
aaaahhhhhh!
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
i was wondering why i didn't see Cody especially I saw #53 playing fullback
which was Kavell Conner, fulfilling a role the Colts had Cody do last year at times. I think it doesn’t bode well for Cody making the team, since his rep was as a ST specialist.
Does anyone know if Jamey Richard got any snaps yesterday, or was he held out with the starters?
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
Starting OL was
Linkenbach – Thomas – Pollak – McClendon – Terry
and subs were:
J Williams, DeVan, Martinez and Marinelli
McClendon played some C in the second half last night
Interesting about Pollak. I didn’t notice him at C
"We ARE going to our own private island, Chris: it's called the State Fucking Fair!"
by naptown_ninja on Sep 3, 2010 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Looks good to me but...
I thought Baldwin outplayed Mitch King this preseason
"We ARE going to our own private island, Chris: it's called the State Fucking Fair!"
I agree
Baldwin will make the squad over Mitch King and Marlon Favorite. He has the motor where he can benefit playing next to starting D-linemen and finish the play. I did not see that kind of motor to edge rush from any other backup. He hustles back very much like Mathis to pursue an RB as well. We keep 5 DEs and 5 DTs, IMO.
DE – Freeney, Mathis, Chick, Hughes, Baldwin
DT – Mookie, Muir, Moala, Foster, one of Mitch King/Marlon Favorite/Ricardo Mathews
I like Skinner
over Newton too, for what it’s worth. Why pick up a slow vet, when skinner (who obviously is a bruiser) clearly fits the bill? He and Newton combined to MISS some sure tackles last night, but come on: Skinner is alright
"We ARE going to our own private island, Chris: it's called the State Fucking Fair!"
Once again
Keep these comments constructive. Overall, people are writing great stuff. Many thanks. However, if you come in here and start insulting me or anyone else because you don’t agree with an opinion, out swings the banhammer. Some of you have done this, which is why a few comments are deleted a a few warnings have been issued.
Thanks. Keep the cool comments rolling. Leave the venom for the Texans.
SB Nation's Indianapolis Colts blogger at Stampede Blue and editor of SB Nation Indiana.
Banhammers rule
My bad, btw. Warning accepted.
I haven’t gotten my usual dose of preseason viewing this year but this seems like another year to get really excited about the D Line – about the third in a row. We’re all listing off 11 or 12 guys who have shown something, and we’re all going to be crushed if “our guy” (for many of us, that’s King) gets cut.
But being a good guy who plays hard in 4Q of a PS game doesn’t necessarily make one a game-changer. For all the talent and optimism we had last year, we still couldn’t overcome Freeney’s ankle and get pressure last year. We saw next to nothing out of Moala (which is fine… unless the same is true this year), and several guys never actually dressed.
I say this not to put anyone down or sound like a pessimist… just to point out that it’s neither the end of the world nor a reason to flip out and argue for 200 posts when DL 10 is chosen over DL 11.
It’s going to suck to see Dawson go… dude was never a star but he was a low cost player that got significant snaps from day 1… was a good guy and good story. What does a guy like that do after this? I guess he could probably catch on somewhere else.
Cut days make me sad.
Cookie Cookie Cookie starts with C!
Dude
Love your comments, but in general people need to chill. Thank god the real season is starting soon. All this energy people have can finally get channeled into games that actually matter.
SB Nation's Indianapolis Colts blogger at Stampede Blue and editor of SB Nation Indiana.
i really don't see what you're bitching about, BBS
you post something, encourage people to comment, then tell them to chill????
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
The new Stampede Blue:
If you like it:
“Yes, BBS I agree.”
If you don’t:
“No, BBS I don’t agree.”
Otherwise you are threatened with the banhammer.
Nothing wrong with that
I have no problem with people disagreeing with me. I have a big problem with people disagreeing with me AND insulting me or my writers AND acting like douchebags. More than half the comments in here are people saying my guess is off, but instead of getting upset that I didn’t include X Person or I did include Y Person, they simply offer their own counter-argument.
Keep the good posts coming, peeps.
SB Nation's Indianapolis Colts blogger at Stampede Blue and editor of SB Nation Indiana.
yeah, i wondered about that too. Ervin has played really well.
Careful what you wish for... "A government big enough to give you everything you want is a government big enough to take from you everything you have." Gerald Ford, 38th US president
Looked at previous rosters, and
in 2004 and 2006 there were 6 WRs on the roster (at least when that roster was saved).
True
Pyatt was some kind of KR, wasn’t he? When the WR is a KR/PR, yes, 6 is a valid justification.
Last year: 4 TEs, 3 QBs, 5 safeties
This year: 3 TEs, 2 QBs, 4 safeties
That is 3 spots possibly right there:
So, compared to last year, we could have 1 extra LB (7 as opposed to 6), 1 extra WR, and 1 extra DL (DL rotation greater than OL, hence the thought process).
But I still think Gijon Robinson is retained as the 4th TE (call me nuts but that is my gut call or nuts call :-)), and suddenly we have 2 extra spots – most likely the 7th LB is certain.
If it is 6 WRs, then both Blair White and Brandon James make it. Taj Smith has a torn hammy, unavailable for 5 weeks even if he makes the roster.
I don't understand the ring or bust mentality
This team isn’t as good as last year, and last year’s team wasn’t good enough to win the title. I can’t see us getting back to the game, let alone winning it.
Ring or bust
This team won the AFC last year. They retained most of their starters and they are getting Bob Sanders and Anthony Gonzalez back. They are clearly the favored team in the AFC, along with the Jets and Ravens.
It’s ring or bust. Just how it is when your team is this good.
SB Nation's Indianapolis Colts blogger at Stampede Blue and editor of SB Nation Indiana.
We're getting Sanders back every season.
And then, inevitably, we lose him for a season. The man is g-damn tyrannosaurus when he is on the field, but his intensity becomes a double-edged sword when it lands him on the IR.
I’m rooting for him to buck the trend this year, but you need to face the trend: He’s out-for-season by the middle of October.
Que flamethrowers in 3…2…1…
What is both surprising and delightful is that spectators are allowed, and even expected, to join in the vocal part of the game.... There is no reason why the field should not try to put the batsman off his stroke at the critical moment by neatly timed disparagements of his wife's fidelity and his mother's respectability. ~George Bernard Shaw
Cue flamethrowers?? Oooookay.

I don’t disagree, it’s just that…. well, you did ask for it. 

------
"How can a pickup truck contain enough mass to unfold into a towering machine? I say if Ringling Brothers can get 15 clowns into a Volkswagen, anything is possible."
When was the last time a Super Bowl team made it back to the big game?
Let alone win it?
It’s just not a realistic expectation. And in sports, players rarely stay at the same level year to year, especially younger players – some will progress, some will regress.
And, most importantly, football’s still half won in the trenches and the Colts have done little to their mediocre offensive and interior defensive lines.
Won’t make it back to the game, let alone win it.
by eltharion_doa on Sep 3, 2010 2:06 PM EDT up reply actions
I can't for the life of me figure out why the Jets are getting so much hype.
And I think to write off New England is pretty crazy as well. That offense is going to be really good again, and their defense is a year more experienced (though they are being hit with the injury bug early).
If I were going to pick a team to upset New England (I would consider it an upset) it would be Miami…
I don't rate the Jets either
Patriots, depending on how well their rebooted defense clicks, and the Ravens are the big threats for me. Wouldn’t surprise me if the Jets miss the playoffs – their defense doesn’t work without Revis and Sanchez isn’t going to get the easy ride he had last season.
by eltharion_doa on Sep 3, 2010 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions
i'm not normally a "championships are everything" guy
but when you’ve done what the Colts have done, 12 wins for 7 years, when the preponderance of ESPN prognosticators pick them to win it, when Peyton is getting older and Polian is nearing retirement, when it’s an uncapped year,
yeah, then it’s time to go for the brass ring (which happens to be a diamond-encrusted superbowl ring)
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
If the preponderance of ESPN prognosticators are picking the Colts
It’s pretty much a guarantee they’ll disappoint. You won’t find a bunch of more clueless idiots than the chumps at ESPN.
by eltharion_doa on Sep 3, 2010 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions
totally fair, but it's an indication expectations should be high
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
High expectations are fine
I don’t think labeling anything short of being the first team in decades, the first team in the modern NFL era, to go from Super Bowl losers to Super Bowl winners in one season as “failure” is realistic or helpful.
It’s one thing to expect good things – entirely another to expect something that never, ever happens to suddenly happen; and to term that exceptionally unlikely thing not happening as failure.
by eltharion_doa on Sep 3, 2010 2:15 PM EDT up reply actions
it sounds like you really believe there's a curse for losing the superbowl
just because a coincidence hasn’t happened doesn’t mean it’s inconceivable. There have only been 44 superbowls, and I’m not sure what you’re defining the modern era as, but that probably cuts the sample size down to 25 or so. Let’s say in any given year 8 teams have realistic chances of winning it all, including last year’s “first loser.” For the loser to never win the next year is like saying you throw an 8-sided die 25 times and never toss a 1. Not very likely, but not inconceivable. Actually there’s over a 3% chance.
Anyway, we’re talking about teams of men trying to beat up other teams of men — not something that probabilities can be reliably worked up for because the billions of factors that swamp it.
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
I don't think it's a curse
It’s regression to the mean. To get to the Superbowl you need a near perfect season – you need a great run with injuries, you need to make all the right plays at all the right times, you need playmakers to step up constantly and you need a bit of help from the refs – whether that be them getting decisions wrong in your favour, or merely not getting them wrong against you.
A Superbowl appearance is a great team getting almost everything right.
It’s vastly, vastly more likely that the next season you get a little more wrong than getting a little more right. All it takes is an injury to Freeney or Mathis in week 14, someone not getting called for a hold as Ray Rice takes a screen pass to the endzone in the AFC championship game or Charlie Johnson turnstiling Manning into a sack on 4th and long against the Patriots and boom! Superbowl chance gone.
It’s not a curse – it’s just probability.
by eltharion_doa on Sep 3, 2010 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Polian is non-Gaussian
the colts don’t operate on the normal curve. Many teams “peak” and crash and the Colts have found a way to sustain and plateau. Polian kept the Bills humming for all those years, and has done here as well.
that being said, I am a generally skeptic too and am aware of black swans. so long as we don’t get more than our share of freakish injuries I like our chances with the redundancy built into the roster.
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
If the Colts had found a way to plateau
They wouldn’t have made two Superbowls in a decade – they’d have made four or five.
The Colts are consistently one of the best teams in the AFC and that’s not going to change as long as Manning is fit, but to expect them to be the best team in the NFL season after season is unrealistic. It’s possible you can get perfect twice in a row – but it’s very, very unlikely.
Far more likely the Colts have a slightly down year this year, and win the Superbowl in 2012.
by eltharion_doa on Sep 3, 2010 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions
ok, i'd settle for a sine wave that got us there every other year
but i want this one!
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
Not as good as last year?
How do you figure?
How can one even know til the end, anyway?
The rest of the AFC is down. This should be the easiest path back to the Super Bowl of the last decade. That of course guarantees nothing. Health and OL play are going to be the keys.
Cookie Cookie Cookie starts with C!
ummmmmmm.. Willy?
If he couldn’t possibly know ‘til the end, anyway’… how can you know that the rest of the AFC is down?
just askin’
Careful what you wish for... "A government big enough to give you everything you want is a government big enough to take from you everything you have." Gerald Ford, 38th US president
Superman
As long as Manning is up to being Superman again, they will be fine. If he can once again overcome starting virtually every drive at the 20, can routinely convert 3rd and 8, and can produce one of the highest point totals in the league on the fewest number of possessions, then yes, they will be fine. Problem is no one can do that forever. The greatest QB in the history of the universe couldn’t do it every year. You cannot expect Manning to once again carry a team with zero running game, shit special teams and a defense that cannot get off the field on 3rd down. Some year, possibly this year, Manning is going to put in a less than superhuman performance, and the team will fall off precipitously(see first half of 2008.)
by Cole Farrington on Sep 3, 2010 3:11 PM EDT up reply actions
I think they'll be fine too
But “fine” is making the playoffs and winning a game or two, not “if we don’t win the Superbowl, it’s a disastrous failure”.
My point is that expecting a team to win the Superbowl in any season is stupidly unrealistic – expecting them to do it the season after losing the Superbowl, something nobody has done in at least 25 years, beggars belief.
by eltharion_doa on Sep 3, 2010 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions
i wouldn't call it a disastrous failure -- just a disappointment
All the teams are “on scholarship” and bad freakish stuff is going to strike all of them too.
It’s always a crapshoot, but there’s nary a team with more reason to be optimistic than the Colts.
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
It is always a crapshoot
But it’s a crapshoot we won last season – expecting us to win twice in a row in the NFL is a bit like hitting 18 in roulette and sticking it all straight back on 18. You might get lucky again…but it’s pretty unlikely.
by eltharion_doa on Sep 4, 2010 12:14 AM EDT up reply actions
we didn't win last year, we just crapped out after another amazing run at the table
and it was a big one-game let-down, but not a colossal season-ruining failure.
I think my 8-sided die analogy is slightly better than the roulette wheel metaphor. Not every team has an equal chance, but once you get to the playoffs, any of those 12 teams just have to rip off four in a row, and 4 of them have to just get three, the first being at home. I hope for your own sake you have an alternate team to root for this year since you’re so fatalistic about the Colts’ chances. As usual, all we have to do is be better than Houston, Jacksonville, and Tennessee to get our marble into one of the prime slots for the big plinko game at the end.
I do like that you said bet on 18. Niiiiice.
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
Unfortunately,
you’ve stated it fairly accurately. It all comes down to Manning. But, he usually IS superman. So, I’m still optimistic. If we could just have improvement in one area (say special teams), I would be thrilled. I’m so sick and tired of the Colts starting drives from the 20 yard line….year in and year out.
Better?
So, from what you’ve seen in the preseason, you are convinced they will now:
1. Have a running game.
2. Have special teams which are not a liability. &
3. Have a defense that can get off the field on 3rd down?
You’ve seen something I have not. They may very well be better at every position, but that doesn’t change the overall picture. This is not a balanced team. Once again, they will go as far as Manning can carry them
by Cole Farrington on Sep 3, 2010 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions
If you are using the preseason...
To judge the way the team will perform as a unit on game day during the regular season, you are doing the wrong thing.
1. Joseph Addai has looked better than any time in his career, save maybe his rookie season, in preseason games. The starting offensive line has not played together at any point this preseason. Reaching a conclusion that the running game will not be better than last season based upon two or three backups playing starting roles, is a little foolish in my opinion. Brody Eldridge is clearly a massive blocking upgrade at the tight end position. If I was a gambling man, I would put money on our run game improved this season. Leading the league? No. Better than 2009, yeah, I would say so. Not based on “numbers in preseason” which mean ZERO, but based on what I’ve seen out of the players who will make or break that outcome.
2. Our first team coverage units have been solid. Our coverage woes occurred late in games when third stringers and guys who will not even make this team were on the field. Our return game will improve, guaranteed. No, I don’t think this unit will lead the league either. I do believe they’ll increase our kick return average by five or more yards, no matter which guy ends up earning the job. Simpson and our blocking were terrible last year. All of our potential returners and our blocking has looked better to this point. I think the players filling our special teams units will be better than they were a year ago as well.
3. The only real question regarding our defense’s ability to get off of the field on third down is the short zone pass coverage. Do I think that a healthy Hayden, Powers, and Lacey will be better than the hodge-podge of injured players at the end of players playing hurt at season’s end last year? Yes. Do I think our corner depth is better than it was last year? Yes. Do I think our linebackers are deeper this year than last? Yes. Do I think our ability to generate pressure on the quarterback is higher this year than last? Yes. Do I think our run defense will improve yet again? Yes. Short yardage was actually our forte last year, and our defensive line looks easily better just based on our players.
So again, if you’re reaching judgments and conclusions about how you think our team will play during regular season games based upon “how they played” in the preseason, I think you’re making the wrong evaluations. We suck every year in the preseason. Last year we looked terrible and came out making far fewer mistakes, suffering drastically fewer penalties, won close games against the Jaguars and Dolphins only to destroy the Cardinals.
This has been the rule of the Colts in preseason every year. Not an exception. Nothing new.
by bamock on Sep 3, 2010 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
mostly agree
The only thing I would question are your comments about depth. I think our depth at LB and CB now is better than it was at the end of last season but certainly not compared to how I felt at the beginning of last season.
Our lineback depth last year was shocking. We had guys who had been legitimate starters for us as backups. I really like Angerer and think he is going to be a good player, but until he plays for real we won’t know this. Last year we did know about our depth.
At CB we had a couple of young experienced guys coming off of injuries that should have been an immediate upgrade. We had a couple of rookies that I thought would season for a year and be good. We got terrifically lucky with our CB rookies last year and I would be shocked if the rookies who are our depth this year could pull the same thing off.
Linebackers are no worse than last year
We lost Keiaho and Hagler. Hagler went on IR after 6 games and was replaced by Cody Glenn. Angerer is already an upgrade over Keiaho, who had been getting the mop-up minutes at ILB. Kavell Conner just has to be equal to Hagler/Glenn. Session, Humber, and Wheeler can all be expected to make at least some progress in their second and third years.
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
I applaud your optimism
But you’re deluded.
by eltharion_doa on Sep 3, 2010 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't think so
The easy position is irrational and blind optimism.
It’s much harder to look at your favourite team without emotion and clinically analyse it’s strengths, weaknesses, assets and liabilities without letting your judgement be clouded.
Our offensive line is worse, our defensive line was a big problem last year and is no better, our special teams remain utterly awful and it’s unrealistic to expect a couple of injuries at most to key players in consecutive seasons.
by eltharion_doa on Sep 3, 2010 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions
So if we're optimistic
we’re stupid homers. And if we see doom around every corner we’re objectively analytical? I recc’d Bamock’s post because I think he’s right. And you know he does his home work (check out coltzilla) I’m still a little sketched by the O line, but by and large I think we have an improved team this year. Getting pumped for opening day for me means adding the good news from the off season and downplaying the worrries. Fandom is an emotional thing. It’s OK. It’s fun. You worry. I’ll scream at the TV.
"We ARE going to our own private island, Chris: it's called the State Fucking Fair!"
by naptown_ninja on Sep 3, 2010 4:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh yeah
Expecting the Colts to get to the AFC Championship game is totally seeing doom around every corner.
My issue is with the unrealistic expectations, not with optimism. If you think anything less than a Superbowl win is a failure, you’re being unrealistic. If you’re optimistic about the Colts chances in any given game, and optimistic for the season in general, that’s completely different.
Things don’t need to be black and white – the choices aren’t “win the Superbowl” or “nuke Indianapolis”.
by eltharion_doa on Sep 4, 2010 12:21 AM EDT up reply actions
we had a plentiful dose of injuries last year, we just handled it well
Sanders, Gonzo, Sorgi, Santi, Federkeil, Donald Brown, Keyunta Dawson, both starting DEs, Tyjuan Hagler, Marlin Jackson, Kelvin Hayden, Francisco, Powers. They all missed at least a few games apiece last year due to injury. Throw in the Ed Johnson fiasco and that’s plenty of adversity overcome.
I also think our DL was quite good last year and has gotten a lot better due to internal improvement and adjustment to the Coyer scheme. Then there’s the additions of Chick, Baldwin and Hughes, and Moala is a new man. I whimpered the day they released Brock, but now I quaver not.
We can’t judge special teams until week four at least. The week 1 special teams squads haven’t played a snap yet. Every team will have the yips and adjustments the first two weeks, but by the bye week we should be able to have a preliminary assessment of the ST,
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
Sanders and Gonzo were the only serious long term injuries
To key players. Any time you can get through an NFL season with just two quality players out for a long time, and no more, you’ve beaten probability by miles. Losing your backup QB, backup RB, depth defenders and getting niggles and knocks to starters – this is absolutely nothing. It’ll happen to every single team in every single season as long as the NFL is a contact sport.
I like Hughes, but otherwise we’ve at best stood still on the defensive line. I’ve seen absolutely nothing from them in the pre-season, and even Hughes has only really performed against scrubs. To be fair, that’s where he’s seen most of his snaps and you can only beat the guys you’re up against.
by eltharion_doa on Sep 4, 2010 12:24 AM EDT up reply actions
To the contrary...
It is easier to use history and “rational” comparisons to other teams who have failed to live up to expectations as a reason to believe that an optimistic outlook about the season or a potential Super Bowl return is foolish. It is also the safest position to take.
If you are right, if we regress and fail to live up to the unrealistic and foolish expectations that are espoused by the deluded masses, you can say “I told you so.” If the team succeeds, as those of us deluded enough to believe have suggested, you win again because your favorite team has a great season, and possibly another Super Bowl victory.
It is also irresponsible and lazy to suggest that my optimism, outlook, or evaluation is “blind” given the fact that I espouse the rationale behind my opinion each time I present it. Rather than arguing my observations, you spew your negative or “realistic” outlook from a self-constructed tower of clarity.
Let’s make this educational. So we can evaluate in a meaningful way the rationale behind our differing opinions. Let’s shed some light so it is clear that neither party is “blind” in their conclusions.
1. Peyton Manning looks fantastic, has won at least 12 preseason games seven years in a row, along with consecutive NFL MVP awards. I think we can agree that there is a VERY high likelihood that the Colts make it to the postseason. That puts the team in the top 12, and at most four wins away from another Super Bowl victory.
2. Joseph Addai has looked incredible in all three phases of his game this preseason. If he continues this trend, it is reasonable to believe that he puts up numbers at least equal to 2009 — excepting a total and complete blow up by the offensive line. It is reasonable to believe that Donald Brown will not regress in his second season. Unless of course you suspect that he takes a noticeable step backward. If so, why?
3. This wide receiver group is easily superior to the one a season ago. Manning has more weapons than he did in 2009, and can absolutely allow any team, no matter how strong, to pick their poison. If you are going to beat the Colts, consistently, you’ll have to put up some points. Thinking otherwise is either unrealistic or unnecessarily negative.
4. The tight end position is developing and stronger than it was last year. Eldridge is undoubtedly a blocking upgrade, has the hands to make an impact in the passing game, and Tamme is clearly better than he was a season ago. If Tamme needs to spell Clark for any time, the drop-off should be negligible. No, he is not Clark, but yes he is a better receiver than Robinson and has shown as much or more in the preseason than Santi did in 2009.
5. The offensive line has THE SAME rotation other than Lilja. Pollak, McClendon, Thomas, and Ugoh, who should develop in their new starting role(s) throughout the year. Assuming the line is not “quite” as good, I don’t foresee the drop-off we saw from Tarik Glenn to Tony Ugoh following 2006. I don’t see how that is unreasonable in anyway. Did Ugoh kill our chances? Absolutely not.
6. Last season, our depth at defensive tackle relied solely on an unproven and struggling rookie (who anyone can see has improved), a player who is primarily receiving time at defensive end this year (Foster), a player with drug issues who is no longer on the team, and another player who has moved on to Tennessee but played almost entirely at defensive end as well. Oh, and our starting defensive tackles were both in their first years as starters, and as a tandem. Our starting defensive tackles have a year of experience, Moala has clearly improved, either Favorite or King will be better true defensive tackle depth than we had a year ago, and Foster is looking like a superior pass rusher this season. Foster, King, and Baldwin have all shown strength, improvement, or looked effective at defensive end. Hughes will develop throughout the year and build on the speed he displayed against the Bengals. I suppose you can take a dreary outlook and think they will all bust or regress.
7. Our linebackers were stronger last year than they have been in a long time. Session improved last season, Brackett played the best football of his career, Wheeler received his first starting experience, and Angerer appears to have the ability right now, and the potential to take over by the end of the year as a starer (for Wheeler). Humber was solid in relief last season, looked great against the Bengals. Conner has also looked like a developing player capable of having at the least a noticeable impact on special teams this year. If Glenn gets cut, clearly the coaches feel they have superior options to last season. If he is retained, it is reasonable to believe that he also will improve and continue to impact special teams. Don’t think so? Why?
8. Our corners, functionally, a year ago consisted of Hayden for half of the year, two rookies serving as primary starters, and a former third round pick who was abhorred by a significant number of fans. In his place will be 13 year veteran who will have to be a spectacular failure to not live up to Jennings’ reputation. I suppose there is a moderate concern about rookies or first year players serving as the depth behind those FOUR corners, but this is obviously better than we were a season ago. And the rookies have gained experience worthy of at least a modicum of confidence. Think last years rookies will regress? Think Townsend will lose us games? Maybe injuries will cost us? Give me a reason without having an unnecessarily negative outlook and we can talk.
9. Our safeties add a healthy Bob Sanders. It can be assumed, in the gloom and doom perspective, that he won’t last throughout the season. But judging on what we know today, there is little arguing that our safeties are stronger than last year, that Sanders playing deep more often will result in both superior pass and run defending from our secondary. If you want to argue or believe otherwise, that is fine. But with Melvin Bullitt taking the place of Jamie Silva as our primary backup safety is hands down superior to last season. Disagree? If so, why?
10. Any of the returners project to be better options than Chad Simpson. Our blocking and return averages have all been superior in the preseason. There is reason to believe, based on skill and what we’ve seen, that our return game will be better this year. Think not? Why?
11. I say again, our kick return coverage units have looked great, outside of late in games when the third and fourth stringers were filling those roles and the players who were most likely to make the final cut were resting. Think we’ll regress on special teams? What justifies that?
12. Vinatieri and McAfee both have looked excellent. Should we worry?
So where does that leave us? Do you see a widespread destruction along the offensive line? If so, justify that position. Do you see a special teams regression? If so, justify it. Why, exactly, outside of referring to history, the performance of previous teams, and other things unrelated to the actual Colts team that will take the field on Sundays, do you believe what you believe?
by bamock on Sep 3, 2010 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Nice said, and Rec'd
Careful what you wish for... "A government big enough to give you everything you want is a government big enough to take from you everything you have." Gerald Ford, 38th US president
I've explained my position
If you don’t agree, that’s fine.
by eltharion_doa on Sep 4, 2010 12:15 AM EDT up reply actions
silliness
real life doesnt always bend to mathematical certitudes. Math doesnt take into account the non measurable. You talk about how much all these units sucked last year and we were in the Super Bowl. The year we won the Super Bowl, we had a historically putrid run game but that turned on a dime in the playoffs. Reality trumps logic and math all the time. To put it in terms you will understand, think chaos theory instead of reversion to mean. Good drafting trumps reversion to mean. Math proves that the coin can land on edge ANY number of times and the law of averages works because math just extends the sample size until it behaves predictably.Reversion to mean says we cannot have won 12 games in so many consecutive seasons yet we have. Reversion to mean says Dima
by Lucky Horseshoe on Sep 3, 2010 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions
continued . . .
Reversion to mean says Dimaggio couldnt hit in 56 consecutive games but he did. Ditto for Unitas throwing a TD in 47 straight games. Every Monday morning during that streak, you would printed a headline saying that mathematically he couldnt do it again . . . and each subsequent Sunday he did it. Eventually you would have been right of course. That is where the broken clock/blind squirrel theory comes in.
by Lucky Horseshoe on Sep 3, 2010 6:48 PM EDT up reply actions
You've completely missed the point, I'm afraid
It’s typical of the attitude on this site – if you don’t think the Colts will win every game by 50 points on the way to five consecutive Super Bowl titles, breaking every record known to the NFL, you’re obviously completely wrong.
Sure, they might do that. Enjoy the delusion.
by eltharion_doa on Sep 4, 2010 12:18 AM EDT up reply actions
Nobody thinks that.
We’re just not as hung up on “curses” as you is all. We get it, we won’t make the SB because of odds. Don’t call us stupid, or imply it, because we don’t put as much stock into a curse. The Colts will make as far as they can on merits not witchcraft. The Saints did not win last year due to voodoo. Curses are for children and mental patients. Odds are for gamblers. Neither decides who gets to the SB.
by ActionOxford on Sep 4, 2010 10:43 AM EDT up reply actions
You're right. Expect the unexpected.
Past performance doesn’t indicate future results.
Eltharion is making an inductive mistake, thinking that just because superbowl losers havent frequently repeated means that there’s some inexorable natural law against it. He also seems to believe a “perfect” football team is required. You just need the team that is good enough to win a critical mass of games (by even one point) and survive the rigors and injuries with smart adjustments to make a run in January.
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
Yes, he will not make it. I'm 99% sure.
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
Re: Brandstater
I have seen a lot of comments in various threads that people think Brandy looks more comfortable in the pocket / on the field than Painter. I agreed with that statement in the first couple of games we saw him, but honestly I thought (despite the results) he looked less comfortable last night than he had in games past.
Just an observation…
How can you not love a team that does this?
He made more plays
But looked much less comfortable and aware.
by eltharion_doa on Sep 3, 2010 4:20 PM EDT up reply actions
i didn't mind him taking sacks
that is partly on him for not getting rid of the ball, partly on the OL
and a sack is always preferable to a pick
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
super bowl or bust
We may or may not win the super bowl this year, but it will have very little to do with the roster moves made over this off season. It will have to do with injuries, execution, coaching, schedule oddities and most of all luck.
The Colts have been a championship caliber team for quite some time. Their best team over that time did not win the Super Bowl (or even get close). One of their most flawed teams did. I’m confident that this years team continues that championship caliber tradition and that is all you can ask for going into the season.
Finally, I can’t disagree more about Brown. Its not that I don’t think he will be a good player, but watching him this offseason he is no better than the guys we have on the team this year. He may grow into a bigger role in time but for now he is a project and I don’t see him out performing Ugoh (and I assume Johnson once he is healthy). Angerer has proven to me that he is a great addition to this team who adds depth at a position of need and I’m happy to have him.
Broncos just lost Lendale White for season
so they will snatch any RB we leave off the 53 man roster
Nah
Josh McDaniels is so good, he’s going to play without running backs at all this season.
by eltharion_doa on Sep 3, 2010 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions
who was running well
in the broncos game I saw
"We ARE going to our own private island, Chris: it's called the State Fucking Fair!"
by naptown_ninja on Sep 3, 2010 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions
and it looks like Blair White's chances are up
because Taj Smith got injured in practice last Wednesday and he either will be cut or placed on PUP to start the season.
i would love it if the Colts used the PUP list to stash Taj and other players (James Williams?)
just to see how things shake out with injury over the first couple of weeks. call it practice squad plus.
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
thanks for that, Ty. Guess that's one rule that won't bend our way.
"To be a great football coach, you have to be smart enough to do it well, and dumb enough to think it's important." -- Can't remember whom I am paraphrasing.
Agree
I think I remember reading or hearing somewhere that Chris Polian really likes and had a big say in the Colts signing Blair White. I think it’s a pipedream to think White would clear waivers and make it to the practice squad…I think he’s on the 53 man roster.
they'd be foolish to let him go
Careful what you wish for... "A government big enough to give you everything you want is a government big enough to take from you everything you have." Gerald Ford, 38th US president
White was our leading receiver for the preseason.
Most receptions, most yards, and longest pass.
Here are the official NFL stats.
Thanks for that.
I wish they showed total targets. It seems like White had far fewer targets than the others, but maybe I’m just remembering wrong.
Careful what you wish for... "A government big enough to give you everything you want is a government big enough to take from you everything you have." Gerald Ford, 38th US president
Painter will make the team:
I think the best context in which to determine if the Colts want Painter as the back-up QB is to look at the back-up position long term. Polian makes a lot of decisions looking at the long view and I think that if the Colts determine that for the 2011 season, Painter is not their man, that does not mean he is not the back-up to begin 2010.
If an apocalypse happens in the 1st 3 weeks this year, the Colts are going to want Painter in there instead on Brandstater because Curtis is simply more ready for the role; right now.
If the Colts determine that Painter is not the long term answer, they will keep 3 QB’s so Brandstater has a year under his belt with this offense for next year. If they have determined that Painter is the best long term bet for right now, Brandstater will be on the PS.
I agree with BBS that Painter is on his way out, but he will make the team this year as Brandstater will be the primary back-up in 2011.
Also keep in mind...
(Pre-emptively, thanks for already noting that the Colts will hit the waiver wire, so the 52nd and 53rd man to make the roster probably won’t be on it for long.)
The injury situation will affect the initial 53-man roster. Say, for instance, the Colts are hurting on the OL (they are.) They’re more likely to keep a bubble OL, then, than a bubble WR or RB (where they’re healthy.) I wouldn’t be surprised if someone like Blair White (just an example) doesn’t make the 53-man squad at first but is called up to the roster once the OL is healthy again. The question, then, is whether or not you can stash a guy like White on the PS long enough for that position to heal.
by Collin McCollough on Sep 3, 2010 5:40 PM EDT reply actions
You make a lot of good points
I agree that Brandon James needed to have a Devin Hester type performance returning to solidify a spot on this team. That would be like saying Curtis Painter needed to have a Peyton Manning type performance at the QB position. In other words, it’s impossible and just a nice way of saying, “Buh bye.” I initially disagreed with Moore’s making the roster, because a) he looked only so-so last night returning, and Ray Fisher just looks better in my opinion. I also thought Baby J looked pretty decent, and he would get the nod at the fourth RB. Yet, he is similar to Hart, and Hart is the proven vet. Also, J is not a return man.
Moore is, and the sample size is too small to really determine who is better b/w Moore and Fisher. Both have looked great at times, and Simpson-ish at others. Both are head and shoulders above BJames, though. Plus, as BJames dropped some easy passes, is too small to block, on top of the botched return, one fluke TD pass is only worthy of a future story to his grandkids. Not worthy of making the final squad. I’d be okay with him PSd though.
One person I am glad you did not include was Cloherty. He was AWFUL blocking last night.
"A lot of times, Kenny, we have no idea what we're doing. But the DEFENSE doesn't know that we don't know what we're doing.....and that's next level." -Peyton Manning
Disregard comments on BJames
I only saw a portion of the game, and he looked bad to me. A friend just texted me and asked if I knew he scored twice more and looked good doing it. Weird timing. Muhbad.
"A lot of times, Kenny, we have no idea what we're doing. But the DEFENSE doesn't know that we don't know what we're doing.....and that's next level." -Peyton Manning

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