Colts Release First Depth Chart For 2011 Regular Season
by Brad Wells on Sep 7, 2011 11:34 AM EDT
in 2011 Colts News
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PrintIt's not updated on the colts.com (because the guys in charge of the team. just. don't .care), but Paul Kuharsky tweeted the 'official' depth chart, which the team sent out to all their media buddies.
Newsflash: I'm not a Colts media buddy. No blogger is. We get coal for Christmas.
Anyway, prior to Kuharsky's tweet, reader Odin1980 kindly posted a link to a recent Pro Football Weekly article starting the rookie fourth round pick Delone Carter had beaten out Donald Brown as the Colts No. 2 runningback. I reserved my annoyance when reading this article because we hadn't heard anything else about this. As far as any of us knew, Donald Brown was the team's No. 2 back. If he wasn't the No. 2 back, there was simply no reason to keep him.
I mean, come on! If you are a first rounder and you can't beat out a fourth round rookie, you REALLY stink. Plus, with Javarris James getting cut, it made no sense to have Brown as the No. 3. James, unlike Brown, was a good special teams player and a solid goal-line and short yardage back.
Thus, the thought of Donald Brown as the No. 3 was ludicrous. Simply ludicrous! Until...
#Colts list Delone Carter as second back, Donald Brown third in new unofficial depth chart. Joe Lefeged is returner. Hughes third RDE.
/BBS's-Face-Turns-Brian-Kelly-Red
Before I rant on the stupidity of keeping Donald Brown as the team's third runningback, here's the depth chart for Week One, 2011:
QB: Peyton Manning, Kerry Collins, Black Hole... er, sorry, Curtis Painter
RB: Joseph Addai, Delone Carter, Donald Brown, Darren Evans
WR: Reggie Wayne, Pierre Garcon, Anthony Gonzalez, Blair White,
TE: Dallas Clark, Brody Eldridge, Jacob Tamme, Mike McNeil
H-B: Austin Collie, Chris Gronkowski
LT: Anthony Castonzo
LG: Joe Reitz
C: Jeff Saturday, Mike Pollak, Jamey Richard
RG: Ryan Diem
RT: Jeff Linkenbach, Ben Ijalana
LDE: Robert Mathis, Jamaal Anderson
LDT: Fili Moala, Drake Nevis
RDT: Antonio Johnson, Eric Foster
RDE: Dwight Freeney, Tyler Brayton, Jerry Hughes
SLB: Pat Angerer, Philip Wheeler
MLB: Gary Brackett
WLB: Kavell Conner, Adrian Moten, Ernie Sims
LCB: Jacob Lacey, Terrence Johnson, Mike Rucker
RCB: Jerraud Powers, Justin Tryon, Kevin Thomas
SS: Melvin Bullitt, Joe Lefeged
FS: Antoine Bethea, David Caldwell
LS: Justin Snow
P: Pat McAfee
***
Quick note: Don't freak out over the H-Back listing. The Colts are not lining up Austin Collie at fullback. H-B is essentially the third WR on pass packages and the FB-TE on short yardage.
OK. Now on to the obvious stupidity inherent in this roster.
First, I'll quote Derek Schultz, radio personality at 1260 AM in Indianapolis:
This may sound weird, but I think I'm listed ahead of Jerry Hughes on the Colts' DE depth chart. #OnlyKindOfJoking
- Hughes is listed as the team's No. 3 DE on the right side, behind Tyler Brayton, who was signed two weeks ago. For those still thinking Hughes hasn't been given a chance, kindly slap yourselves across the face and have a nearby stranger scream in your ear 'WAKE UP!' Hughes is a bust. sorry, but I'm just not taking any arguments in favor of Hughes seriously anymore. Apparently, neither are the Colts.
- Remember, Hughes was kept over John Chick, and Chick pretty thoroughly outplayed Hughes in preseason. You think the Colts decision to dump him over Hughes sat well with Chick? He was offered a spot on the Colts practice squad, but turned it down! He's now with the Jaguars.
- Does it comfort you to know that the Colts have three centers, and that two of them wouldn't be back-ups on any other NFL squad? Why was Kyle DeVan cut again?
- This team cut Tommie Harris, who was well respected in the Colts lockerroom, so they could keep six tight ends. Yep, makes a lot of sense.
- Jacob Lacey, who is a horrible man-to-man cover corner, is starting over Justin Tryon, who is a better man-to-man cover corner.
- And finally, Donald Brown. Brown offers nothing as a special teams player, which is what the 3rd RB on the team has to play. He isn't a good gunner, and he can't return kicks. He also is not all that good at short yardage running, or goal-line running. In short, unless he is backing up Addai and getting significant snaps, there is no reason to keep him. None. Zero. In fact, the only reason I can come up with that he's on the roster is the Colts simply did not want to deal with media bashing them for admitting they busted their first round pick in 2009. That is really all I got!
I'm sure some people will comment that all I'm doing is playing Debbie Downer here, but come on! Look at this roster! Even with Manning healthy, does this look like a team that can beat the Packers? The Steelers? The Ravens? The Patriots?
No, of course not. Even the most blind, pathetically short-sided homer has to see that. Certainly, Football Outsiders doesn't think highly of this team.
Look, not all the roster moves are bad. I like the decision to keep Jamaal Anderson. I like having Brayton in there. I totally agree Delone Carter is the No. 2 back (I listed him in my last guess of the 53-man roster prior to the cut down to 53). I like Collins as the back-up QB. It was good Philip Wheeler was kept.
But many of these other roster decisions just look like they were written in by four-year-olds with crayons. If guys like Hughes and Brown can't even be considered quality back-ups, as third stringers clearly are not, they shouldn't be on the team. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I'm making a big deal out of nothing. Maybe it's unrealistic of me to expect Bill Polian and his kids to cut early round picks (even though the Patriots have cut Darius Butler and Brandon Meriweather the last week or so).
But, I don't think I am being unreasonable in questioning these moves. This isn't a deep team. Depth was tossed aside (like DeVan, Chick, Harris, James) in favor of scrubs (Brown, Hughes, Pollak, Richard).
Am I alone in this opinion? Am I screaming in the dark?
Good lord, after looking at this depth chart, I need a drink... and it's not even noon!
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I don't get the TE mania either
And what about the trade JMV had the colts making ? any news ?
No news
And, if a trade happened right now, would it really matter for Week One?
SB Nation's Indianapolis Colts blogger at Stampede Blue and editor of SB Nation Indiana.
No, it wouldn't
But at least would matter for our matches against the pass happy teams down the road.
I think we need another good CB. Or another DT. I just don’t want another TE, but the last time e said that we signed Gronk
trade fodder
The only logical reason to keep the two draft busts is for a possible trade. Maybe the polians are gonna wait and see how the beginning of the season plays out then try to make a move with the lame ducks by trade deadline. I hope that’s their reasoning because right now it makes about as much sense as a football bat.
by tenaytiousd32 on Sep 7, 2011 11:55 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
You have to remember that PFW article is a fantasy football article
He is anticipating that Delone Carter will supplant Donald Brown as the RB2 on the Colts. So, if you are drafting a FF team now, if your RB10 selection is between the two, go with Delone Carter. I agree. but, my FF league is not that deep where I would be picking the Colts RB2 for my FF team, so I won’t be picking either player.
I didn't do anything wrong!.... and, I won't do it again.
Also, a good reason that the Colts are keeping him on their roster is because of the injury history of Addai
Addai has trouble staying on the field. He goes down and I see a platoon situation with Carter and Brown and the Colts are scrambling for a third RB.
I didn't do anything wrong!.... and, I won't do it again.
All that being said, I think Delone Carter is a keeper and should be considered the heir apparent to Addai right now
He should definitely move ahead of Brown and if Brown is destined to be just insurance for Addai or Carter going down, the Colts should be looking on the waiver line for another RB, which they just might be. I think that might be one of the reasons that the Texans aren’t waiving Steve Slaton and keeping 4 RBs on their roster. He still has some tread on the tire and the South Division opponents that are having issues at RB just might want to test drive him.
I didn't do anything wrong!.... and, I won't do it again.
I have 2 problems: letting DeVan go and keeping Pollak. Otherwise, this is alright. Keeping Hughes was logical, and honestly, Chick would still be the 4th or 5th string DE (if the DE position is that decimated, it’s not looking good anyway). I think keeping Donald Brown was the right move, he may very well end up getting a lot of carries if Addai goes out and I prefer him over James. Harris didn’t offer anything over Nevis & Moala.. except age. I initially don’t like keeping Foster, but I think he’ll be playing in obvious passing situations at the NT (or Nevis) and therefore they felt the need to only keep one true NT. Remember, they have 2 NT’s on the PS if necessary.
www.12thhorseman.com
Ironically, Chick got activated by Jags today as a result of Gerrard getting let go.
"20" - The number of fans in the stands in Jacksonville and students at Vanderbilt actually from Tennessee! Bob Vance, Vance Refrigeration
practice squad
I actually thought it was a bit of a coup to get both Ogbu and Mattews on the PS. They get to keep both of the guys that would have backed Johnson up without having to put them on the 53.
Yeah, I'm Shure.
DeVan
He will be starting for the Eagles, week 1.
Makes sense if you look at it
He was chosen because he fit the Howard Mudd system. He’s already practiced that much of it here in Indy. It would only make sense that Mudd would want at least someone with experience on that line. (Which is one of the worst in the NFL)
Please recall that MANY around here have been calling for a larger OL. The starters are exactly that.
Yeah, I'm Shure.
I understand your frustration with Brown
However, like the previous claims he would be dearly missed if we released him and then Addai or Carter went down. What baffles me, is the Lacey over Tryon and Ernie Sims listed so far down the depth chart. Is it because of his injury? Because unless I’m missing something, I think he’s much better than Conner. Is Conner supposed to be much better than I realize?
by CastroRakesOnTheReg on Sep 7, 2011 11:57 AM EDT reply actions
He would not be dearly missed
Evans has proven to be better. As has James. They are both better options. They should’ve cut Brown and kept James.
Is Joe Reitz the real deal?
If he’s not, Pollack being his primary backup really worries me. This guy came out of nowhere and took the position from Pollack, Devan, and McClendon. I realize that’s not very hard to do but it seemed like odd move by the Colts
by CastroRakesOnTheReg on Sep 7, 2011 12:01 PM EDT reply actions
Not sure on Reitz
But keeping Pollak and Richard over Devan (proven starter), McClendon (better toolset, more potential), Tepper (more promise, possibly already more skilled), and Kirkpatrick (again, more potential) was an incredibly stupid string of decisions. Keeping Richard isn’t even about pride, the guy was a 6th round pick! It was just plain stupid!
by FatDT on Sep 7, 2011 12:12 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
^ this
I saw nothing from Richard… Either pollak or deVan could play center if necessary and given the unproven ability of the oline I think keeping 9 would be a good idea. Maybe Hughes is going to be packaged in a trade for an upgrade! (doubt it tho)
by Kdog@usi on Sep 7, 2011 12:36 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I can't believe
Ernie Simms is listed as the #3 LB behind Connor and Moten. Guys are going to be rotating on the D line. Freeney and Mathis on pass downs with Hughes getting a few plays a game and Brayton and Anderson on run downs. So really the depth chart is deceptive. As far as RB goes Addai, Brown and Carter will all get playing time.
by VERNON HOWELL on Sep 7, 2011 12:09 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
May be a package issue
I’ll bet we see Sims in the Nickle a bunch. He did a great job of covering and is faster than both Angerer and Conner.
Yeah, I'm Shure.
Also
Everything I heard about Tommie Harris is that he was dis liked in the locker room.
by VERNON HOWELL on Sep 7, 2011 12:21 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
This roster is centered around max-protection on offense
If Addai goes down, you need an experienced blocking back. That’s why Brown was kept.
I think there will be lots of 2 TE sets which is why there are so many TEs and Gronk is on the roster.
They must be planning on running down the throat of teams while Peyton is getting healthy. Passing appears to be option #2. Chick was a regrettable situation, but I still want Hughes to have 1 more year. He probably won’t turn into a Freeney or Mathis, but may be better than both Aanderson and Brayton by years end.
"It's about the journey--mine and yours--and the lives we can touch, the legacy we can leave, and the world we can change for the better."
— Tony Dungy
Experienced blocking back?
Experienced at what? Being horrible at blocking? Carter is ahead of him because he already runs and blocks better than Brown. Given time I expect Evans will prove the same and suddenly Brown will be the 4th RB and not even active for games.
Say what you want about how badly Brown ran in preseason
but his blocking was excellent. He blew up Clay Matthews once and did a very good job of recognizing which guy he had to take out. He also is great on 3rd down catching out of the backfield. Collins is very much a check down buy, like or not. If Addai isn’t there, you don’t want to have to trust Carter to be the dump off on obvious passing downs. Brown could be a great screen play back as well. Carter will most likely surpass Brown’s blocking ability mid-season, but until then you have to keep Brown on the roster. If Brown sprains anything more than an eyelash after week 8 he could be headed to IR for someone with more promise at the 3rd RB slot.
"It's about the journey--mine and yours--and the lives we can touch, the legacy we can leave, and the world we can change for the better."
— Tony Dungy
Agreed
This roster is completely about max protect. I may not like Brown, but Polian is keeping someone who has time in this system and wants to get blocking out of him rather than run production. Say what you will about the Colts, but even PM says the Colts would rather keep someone who is a little slower, but has more experience in the system and more “smarts.” I am guessing Brown has the smarts.
The colts require the offensive players to know the plays and to know how to execute their system. They will take less talent for better knowledge. And in this case, with Manning out, I have to agree. I would rather have guys who know what they are doing then a rookie/inexperienced guy who flubs up the blocking calls.
Dear Diary, Kevin is so hot. Today he was raking the yard. God I wish he'd throw me into that pile of leaves.
by GotDebt on Sep 7, 2011 3:22 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Brown
I would have kept spann or James instead unless his money was guaranteed. If his cap hit was the same whether we cut him or not, fine keep him. However spann, evans or James offered as much as brown for, I’m sure, less money…
by Kdog@usi on Sep 7, 2011 12:13 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Better runners
not better pass catchers or blockers. That leads to the theory that Colts are looking for max protect to give Collins time and keep him upright.
"It's about the journey--mine and yours--and the lives we can touch, the legacy we can leave, and the world we can change for the better."
— Tony Dungy
Do you actually believe this?
GMs know they are held accountable for their choices. Polian has been a very successful GM and knows his teams are built around UFAs and late round gems. The more early round guys he keeps that aren’t effective, the less effective UFAs and late rounders he can slip into the roster (i.e. John Chick.) Also, Chris Polian heads up the team and Bill was in charge, so even though Chris likely had a hand in the decision to draft Hughes and Brown, it will be Bill that is held accountable by the media for both players busting.
I honestly think the Colts front office genuinely believes these players have something in them. Whether they do or not remains to be seen until they actually are cut (by the Polians or by their replacements.) Unfortunately for fans, the Polians will likely be given a pass even if the team tanks in 2011 because PM isn’t playing the full season. PM is a large part of why the Polians have been considered successful…
"It's about the journey--mine and yours--and the lives we can touch, the legacy we can leave, and the world we can change for the better."
— Tony Dungy
a small rebuttal
Even with Manning healthy, does this look like a team that can beat the Packers? The Steelers? The Ravens? The Patriots?
Umm.. yes. The only starter we are really complaining about is Lacey. I agree he’s an issue. However, I do not believe that he will single handedly bring down the Colts. (I also think that Tryon will win the starting job before the end of the year.)
Umm.. yes. The only starter we are really complaining about is Lacey. I agree he’s an issue. However, I do not believe that he will single handedly bring down the Colts. (I also think that Tryon will win the starting job before the end of the year.)I do agree that there are some back-up issues.
- I understand keeping Hughes. He should be allowed at least a second year to develop.
- Brown, I get your argument, but until we know for sure that Delone is a starter quality back, he’s cheap and is a good as James or Evans carrying and recieveing.
- Several of the OL people that were kept are puzzling, but the guys that were cut were not starters either.
I simply think that with an easier schedule to begin the season, if the Colts can manage a 2-2 start, or steal a game and get to 3-1 this season isn’t over unless Manning misses way more time than that.
Yeah, I'm Shure.
Man
OF COURSE this team can beat any of the teams you just listed. The Ravens, well, we always beat. We almost beat the Pats last year with a decimated team.
This team is very good, with just some holes to fill. I imagine what life would be for BBS if he was a Jaguars, Titans or Texans blogger.
Brown is a puzzle
The reason he is here does not matter. I seriously doubt the coaches were pounding the table to cut him and Polian was shouting “no way!”. He still is fast and healthy so I guess that is it.. Unfortunately he is also blind.
"If they want me to be a crazy, emotional, frenzied fan in section 603, then they can't expect me to be reasonable about the business of football"
There's a finer point in your post, indylator...
I sincerely doubt the Colts coaches make their picks/cuts, and then send the list to either Polian to decide for them. Like others have posted, we’re not there, day in and day out, judging ability. We see them play in a few pre-season games and then immediately take a polarized attitude, i.e. “they suck” or “they rock”. Like pretty much any professional organization, the bell curve shows that most people are in the middle.
This is a pretty good squad to start the year. With Manning, it would be a darned good squad. From what I read, the Colts look at the season in Quarters. They try this for the first quarter, and then come out with a few changes heading into the second quarter of the season.
Let’s wait until after the first Texans game to pass judgment please.
O line depth
That is the only thing I worry about. I’m okay with the rest of the decisions. Carter’s talent was noticeably superior to everyone else, but the other backs are grouped together, so I’m okay with that decision. Chick may have a better head on his shoulders, but his shoulders aren’t that talented. Hughes has the better shoulders but the lesser head. Chick has hit his talent wall and Hughes hasn’t, so they take a chance on him.
I've said this since he was drafted, but
backs like Donald Brown can be acquired anytime. They’re nothing special. To waste a first round pick on him was incredibly stupid. No matter how ineffective he is, Polian’s massive ego will keep him on the team regardless.
In other news
Kyle Devan is taking 1st team reps with the eagles, acording to Adam Caplan’s twitter.
Just imagine the headline if this was with the colts: “Watkins is a bust. I mean, if you can’t beat a guy that was dumped from a team that has one of the worst O-lines in football, you are a busted first rounder.”
In all seriousness, the Eagles O-line will suck, and with that the team is going nowhere
Tryon
Jacob " I’ll give you 10 yards when you need 7 for the first down" Lacey is a starter!! GO FIGURE!!!!! Gives me NIGHTMARES of Tim Jennings!!!! The latest in the long list of questionable moves by this staff and organization!!!!!!, throw in John Chick as well…. GEEEZZZZZ I am just baffled at the latest moves the top brass has made. With the Irsay tweets, Na’Polians questionable decision making, the Colts have gone from looking like a first class organization to a “who’s on first?? What’s on second?” Organization I just don’t get it. I love our team, I will be supporting them win, lose or draw all season, but geeezzzz. These personal moves are just mind numbing.
This roster can beat anyone with Peyton Manning healthy
That should be pretty clear by now.
With that said, Kyle DeVan should not have been cut. Donald Brown GTFO. Anthony Gonzalez? Are you kidding me. Why was Tommie Harris cut? A lot of questionable moves, but let’s not overreact and say this team isn’t elite with Peyton healthy. They can beat anyone in the league.
Time will tell.
It’s all speculation until next Sunday.
Of the 4 cut,
the two that make ZERO sense to me are DeVan and Harris.
I know they said Harris had an ego issue, but thats fixable…and he made a heck of a play deflecting that pass early in the preseason, showing his vet value.
And DeVan…seriously? Pollack and Richard? Cut Richard, keep DeVan. DeVan can backup guards and center. Richard can, but only if its against 3rd stringers, and then he will probably still get blown off the ball…
Maybe they got the header on their lists wrong…put players on the Cut instead of Save list…who knows, but someone made some mistakes.
DeVan I don't get either
But I disagree about Harris. Attitude is the one thing that is not fixable. In fact, I am surprised that Harris brought any with him after being cut.
A couple of the ex-NFL coach talking heads were discussing why some teams have surprise winning seasons with seemingly little talent (or vice versa when loaded and they tank), and they boiled it down to one word – chemistry. They said that if there is dissension in the team and some bad apples which often are not the outspoken type we fans think of, that it is difficult to turn it around. In other words, if you you have the chemistry, guard it at all cost.
"If they want me to be a crazy, emotional, frenzied fan in section 603, then they can't expect me to be reasonable about the business of football"
Polian is getting more and more like Mike Brown and Al Davis
What these guys have in common is that a lot of their decision making is confusing, and their desire to show that they are in complete control has brought down their franchises.
Best thing for the colts is to tank the season. Not that they really have to try.
by PurdueBoiler1995 on Sep 7, 2011 1:26 PM EDT reply actions
I am going to go out on a limb and claim that Polian
is intensly interested in winning. For that matter so is Irsay. That doesn’t mean he will not make mistakes you might question, but this fooey about being power hungry is silly.
"If they want me to be a crazy, emotional, frenzied fan in section 603, then they can't expect me to be reasonable about the business of football"
Ask the fellas at 56th street if he is power hungry
Polian controls everything, PR, Media, coaches, players, etc. Caldwell is just a puppet. The coach selections over the past few years are just guys he can control. Why did Mudd and Moore leave. They clearly didn’t want to. The offense has been slowly going downhill since. I think Mudd was a bigger factor in the decline. Heck, he passed the reigns to his son, but who is really calling the shots? Is Chris Polian discussing what is happening with Manning to the media? Nope, it’s Billy doing the work, per usual. Don’t be fooled, it’s Billy’s team.
by PurdueBoiler1995 on Sep 7, 2011 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions
come on...
Best thing for the colts is to tank the season. Not that they really have to try.
I can’t believe that is anything but an exageration. “Tanking” is what gets you frahchises like the Bengals and Raiders because to teach a culture it’s ok to give up. NEVER tank. If you get beat, fine. But tanking just teaches you to make excuses for poor play.
Of the Colts first 6 games, the only one that would REALLY shock me if they won is the game vs. the Steelers. Houston and TB will be tough, but the Colts should win (even with Collins) vs Cleveland, Cin, and KC. That is at worst a 3-3 record and possibly a 5-1 record before the tougher part of the schedule starts. IF Manning is back then, there is still a real possibility for the Colts to do very well this year.
Yeah, I'm Shure.
The Colts have quite
a history with ‘tanking’.
Does Austin Collie get any love under WR
I saw him listed under H-B
There are only 4 .5 TEs, not 6. Be precise BBS.
Kevin Thomas should be #2 not #6. Sims should be higher too.
'Max Protect'
Hysterical.
Gronkowski is the man who ended Romo’s season last year. Great pickup!
I must be watching completely different games. A plethora of moves that make zero sense to me. Mike Pollak and Jamey Richard still employed by the Colts makes me want to throw myself into oncoming traffic.
by I'm Not Alone, I'm Just Blue on Sep 7, 2011 4:09 PM EDT reply actions
Call me crazy but I think we get the number 1 pick next year.
So Im somewhat happy.
Has anyone..
heard about the last two PS players?
by BleedingBlueAndWhite on Sep 7, 2011 7:20 PM EDT reply actions
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