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Poll on What We Should Do with our #1 Pick

To all my fellow Colts fans-

I don't post much, but given the fact that I'm a Colts junkie, I'm curious to hear what the overall public opinion is on what we should do with our #1 pick. Hopefully the following poll will clear things up once and for all.

This is as simple as I can make it. Please comment after you vote.

Lets assume Manning will be at 90% (which we all know is optimistic)...

Poll
What should we do with our #1 draft pick?
Keep Manning - Draft Luck
139 votes
Trade/Cut Manning - Draft Luck
66 votes
Keep Manning - Trade the #1 Pick
109 votes
Trade/Cut Manning - Trade the #1 Pick
8 votes

322 votes | Poll has closed

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Stampede Blue's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Stampede Blue's writers or editors.

Comment 67 comments  |  0 recs  | 

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Keep Manning - Trade the #1 Pick

Manning brought us out of the wreckage of what was the 90s Colts. I vote let him shatter the recordbooks with us too.

The plus here is that if Manning stays, it’ll give us some leverage to reduce contracts with some of our vets. Want to be on a Superbowl caliber team? We want you, now prove you’re a team player. I’m talking to you – Wayne, Saturday, Brackett, Mathis, Addai, and Garcon.

by jmkovey on Jan 12, 2012 2:30 PM EST reply actions  

Agreed to Keep Manning/Trade #1 Pick, BUT...

I don’t want Brackett or Wayne back at all. Possibly Wayne if he accepted a 2 yr/$10M deal – which apparently he is not willing to do.

Garcon should be re-signed, even though it will be somewhat pricey – regardless of who our starting QB is.

Addai – Meh. I could see him back if PM is our QB because he loves Addai, but Brown’s emergence and Carter’s flashes (minus the fumbles) make the old/fragile/mediocre/overpaid Addai expendable.

Would love to see Mathis re-signed, but it will probably only happen if we extend Freeney for another ~2 years to free up some 2012 cap space. His cap hit next year is scheduled to be $19 Million (!!!!) if we don’t re-structure (extend).

Would love to have Saturday back, mostly because we don’t have a replacement. At this point in his career, however, Saturday is nothing more than a slight-above-average-center…Which is fine with me – just don’t expect him to ANCHOR an O-Line (that’s why we drafted Castonzo and Ijalana).

www.Coltsider.com
check out the new Colts blog!

by kmbryant09 on Jan 12, 2012 7:17 PM EST up reply actions  

no

drafting luck is the only option that makes sense. that is the only smart choice

by omahacolt on Jan 13, 2012 10:34 PM EST up reply actions  

Luck

Assuming

Manning 2-3 years
Luck 10-15 years and immediate cap relief.

by mlc2656 on Jan 12, 2012 2:32 PM EST via mobile reply actions  

The Colts

are not a Super Bowl caliber team

by Adam McDougal on Jan 12, 2012 3:49 PM EST reply actions  

Keep a healthy Manning

and trade the number one pick.

Cut a finished Manning and keep Luck.

How far into the future can you look with a quarterback? Manning is the bird in hand and Luck is the two in the bush. You really think Luck will go 10 years with this team? How often does that happen? What is the average length of service for an NFL QB?

I think the odds of Luck, whatever he looks like in college, going past 4 years on this team are lower than a healthy Manning going 4 more years on this team. If I’m a betting man, I bet on a healthy Manning and use the picks to work on the team. As bad as the O-Line is, Luck is going to get killed before he figures how to play NFL football.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lists_of_NFL_starting_quarterbacks

by wcwills on Jan 12, 2012 5:16 PM EST reply actions  

what?

I love Peyton as much as anybody but how is a 36 year old who’s had three neck surgeries in 19 months a guarantee to play another full season, let alone 4? You have to take Luck. If he’s nearly as good as people say he’ll be, he’ll be a Colt for a long time. The NFL isn’t like baseball where guys play well until they’re free agents, then go after the most money. Typically, if a QB is good they keep extending with their team. About half of the starting qbs in the league are franchise guys that aren’t going anywhere for years.

by Adam McDougal on Jan 12, 2012 6:37 PM EST up reply actions  

It was a hypothetical

The question assumed that Manning will be back at minimum 90%. That’s why he is assuming that Manning will play for another several seasons.

by Wippersnapper on Jan 13, 2012 10:29 AM EST up reply actions  

I agree 90%

I agree a HEALTHY Manning gives us the BEST chance of competing. His injury though severe was NOT caused by a football play. He does not take the pounding other players with that injury might. I think he will be able to play at a high level for another 3-4 years. Surround him with some quality young talent and address a QB backup thru FA. With the recent hire at GM, I think the style of play in Indy will be changed over the next few years. But it needs to be gradully done. Let Manning run his show, while starting to put things in place for the future. As far as If he can’t return and which player should be drafted. I feel it should be RG3. Reason being the style of football this GM has in his background. Arena league and Philly use Run and Scramble QB’s. RG3 is much better suited for that syle of play. Can you imagin Luck playing in Areana league style of play??? They would knock that pathetic beard right off his face.

by shoospa on Jan 13, 2012 9:55 AM EST up reply actions  

dungy disagrees

dungy said his injury was a result of a football play

by omahacolt on Jan 13, 2012 10:34 PM EST up reply actions  

OK

That’s his opinion of which he is entitled to. I would sure like to know which hit in which game so I can see it! Iv’e probably watched 99% of there games over the past 10 years. Must have missed that one. Please keep me updated if you find it! Thanks.

by shoospa on Jan 13, 2012 10:49 PM EST up reply actions  

The Washington game

2006 season.

It doesn’t matter, though. If it’s fixed, it’s fixed and you keep Manning.

by wcwills on Jan 14, 2012 5:59 AM EST up reply actions  

PLAY WITH INJURY

WOW! Manning played competativly and led the team back to a SB all the while having a serious neck injury for 4 years? Then why? NOW that it has been repaired is everyone so concerned he can NO longer be productive?

by shoospa on Jan 14, 2012 11:55 AM EST up reply actions  

His beard does suck dick

i don't give autographs

by muncie_in_this on Jan 14, 2012 11:13 AM EST via Android app up reply actions  

Easy decision

Take Luck. Opt out of Peytons contract. Use the cap room to go after younger free agents to build around Luck.

by Touchdown.Jesus on Jan 12, 2012 5:48 PM EST via mobile reply actions  

Keep Peyton & draft Luck

drop Painter, Brackett, Addai and Mathis,
Keep Wayne, Saturday, and Garcon.

by 67ChevILL on Jan 12, 2012 5:57 PM EST reply actions   1 recs

Why keep Wayne?

Let’s ignore the pricetag for a second. He’s declined (noticeably) each of the past 2 seasons. At this point in his career, he’s nothing more than an elite route runner in an old man’s, worn-down body. He can’t beat anybody deep, and has lot some of his separation skills.

Yes, he has an established rapport (spelling?) with Manning, but Manning has developed nicely with Garcon/Collie/Tamme/anybody else they bring in. Plus, with a new emphasis on OLine and running game, we don’t need a “plethora” of weapons for PM.

Oh, and also – Wayne is looking to get paid like an elite, #1 WR – which he is clearly not at this point in his career. Why tie up $7-10 Million for the next few years on him?

www.Coltsider.com
check out the new Colts blog!

by kmbryant09 on Jan 12, 2012 7:21 PM EST up reply actions  

beg to differ

Unless you’ve not laid eyes on Wayne, I don’t know how you could say he is “in an old man’s, worn-down body.” Wayne is in as good of shape as he’s ever been. Has his speed diminished slightly? Perhaps. But he was never a speed guy. If we can get him at a relative bargain ($5-6mil/yr), we’d be crazy to let him go, especially if Peyton is back. The continuity would be a huge benefit, and Wayne is very durable… he’s seldom missed time in his career. His and Manning’s familiarity with one another is a good enough reason to consider keeping him.

by Wippersnapper on Jan 13, 2012 10:34 AM EST up reply actions  

First off...

I don’t care what condition his body is – it’s out of his control whether or not his legs lose a step or 2. It happens to everyone, just ask Randy Moss and Terrell Owens.

If you’ve watched Colts games the past few years, then you’ve noticed that Reggie Wayne is significantly slower now than he was 2-3 seasons ago. Is he still valuable? Yes. Is he still a good WR? Probably. But he’s nothing more than an exceptional route runner at this point in his career. He isn’t burning anybody deep, and he isn’t making many plays after the catch.

Also, there was a report a few weeks ago that Wayne is seeking a contract that pays him like a true #1 WR – which is roughly $10M per season. I’d laugh at that request if I was Jim Irsay.

Like I said in my original post at the top of the comment section – I’d love Wayne back for a 2yr/$10M contract, but it sounds like that isn’t even remotely close to the deal that he expects.

www.Coltsider.com
check out the new Colts blog!

by kmbryant09 on Jan 17, 2012 9:30 AM EST up reply actions  

Keep Manning Trade Number #1 pick

..to Browns. Scoop up, at least, their two first round picks. Pick RGIII with the number four pick and another team need with the other.

by BleedingBlueAndWhite on Jan 12, 2012 6:50 PM EST reply actions  

why wouldnt cleveland stay put and draft RG3.

Plus, rams will likely trade #2 to someone looking to gain griffins rights.

So… That scenario is highly unlikely.

by mlc2656 on Jan 12, 2012 9:27 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

EXCEPT THAT

Griffen will probably get at drafted at number 2. Probably by Cleveland, Washington or Miami. If you want a QB in this draft the Colts will have to use most of the picks they get for the #1 pick to move back up to #2. It’s a risky strategy in that you could get outbid by someone else. It also doesn’t make sense when you can just take the better player and prospect at #1.

by javen on Jan 12, 2012 8:16 PM EST reply actions  

Keep Manning and Trade #1 Pick

It sickens me how far we done fell when it comes to Manning, he has been the face of this franchise for his entire career and all of a sudden a few good QB prospects come out of college coupled with Manning missing one season and everyone’s waiting to show him the door.

I say we trade the pick (best option is the Cleveland Browns) and get some Offensive Guards, a few CBs (possibly two) and a SS, the rest can be used for depth.

Manning is a New Orleans native like myself and trust me, us N.O. boys don’t fall easy. We get knocked down 7 times and stand back up 8 times. Manning will come back and kick so much ass, it won’t even be funny.

Colts fan since Tony Dungy's 48th Birthday.

Free will is an illusion, but pragmatically, the illusion of self (ego), choice, freedom, consciousness, are all necessary for the game or struggle to move. No struggle, no universe.

Get well soon, Peyton Manning

by ColtsFan504 on Jan 12, 2012 11:50 PM EST reply actions   1 recs

JUST STAY IN SCHOOL

With any LUCK the Golden Child will stay in school and keep working on that pittiful beard! That will make the decision VERY easy. Anyone who thinks the Colts should get rid of a HEALTHY?? Manning is out of there fricken mind!!!! Irsay will never let it happen. If healthy(Which only Peyton himself knows) he will retire in 5 years as the GREATEST QB to ever play the game! Luck on the otherhand will probably go to some mediocor team and have an injury plauged career!!! NO collage QB anywhere out there is going to come into todays NFL and make the same kind of impact Manning did. Mainly, because the game has progressed and the defensive players are much bigger and faster! Trade the pick, surrond Peyton(IF HEALTHY) with some quality players on both sides of the ball. Be competative and have a solid cast of young talent to build on for th future. There will always be another once in a lifetime prospect next year or the year after that!!! If Peyton HIMSELF says he is not healthy or wants a trade, At that point we will have to deal with it.

by shoospa on Jan 13, 2012 8:48 AM EST reply actions  

Yeah..well I think your out of your frickin mind

Hes 36 years. Old and owed a boatload of money and has had 3 neck surgeries in 19 months and has not played in almost a year and half. Time to go young or Luck in this case.

by armycolts25 on Jan 13, 2012 1:11 PM EST up reply actions  

It's always tough to read your comments

The poor spelling and run on sentences make you look ridiculous when you’re trying to prove that your opinion is the smart choice. I just like that those of us who want to trade the pick say it’s the best choice. People like yourself who want to draft Luck and ditch the only reason the Colts are still in Indy are so stubborn about it that they say it’s the only choice. Keep living in the moment.

You weren’t posting about the contract being awful when he signed it. His surgery has taken, and doctors who are familiar with the procedure say it will not affect his career.

You will be on here in roughly a year saying how it was so amazing that the Colts kept Peyton, and he turned the team back into a contender.

by PeytonTheManning on Jan 13, 2012 8:25 PM EST up reply actions  

I'm sorry I'm not living up to your standards in writing, but I really don't care

When I type on my IPhone or IPad it does not always turn out the way I want. It’s nice you have the nerve to call me stubborn, do you read your own writing ? I want the long term solution not the short term like you. I’m a fan of the TEAM and not just Manning like you are and before I ended up in combat I had season tickets. Manning has been great and should get a lot of credit but he is not the only reason the Colts are still in Indy. Win or lose I’m with the team and I’m not on here to attack people personally.

I will leave that to you.

by armycolts25 on Jan 13, 2012 9:17 PM EST up reply actions  

How's that accurate?

The title of your last post was “Yeah…well I think you’re out of your frickin’ mind.” Can’t help but feel like you started the personal attacks. I’ve never presented my opinion as the only option. I present facts and statistics that show that trading for multiple picks is the more prudent decision. The Colts are just as likely to get a QB with one of the numerous picks they receive for trading the pick.

I have been a fan my whole life through the Trudeau, George, and Harbaugh years. I don’t feel like drafting
Luck is planning for the future, because he won’t play
for 4 seasons. His contract will be four years. That means the Colts will have to sign him to a second contract before he’s even the starter. Kolb got 5 years and 63 million, because he had a few good games as a backup. The Colts would probably have to invest more like $70-80 million by that time. That’s assuming Luck didn’t already force a trade out of town, and that he would want to resign with a team that made him sit for four seasons. Everybody seems to forget that his reaction to this situation may not match what fans want. Why in the world would he want to sit? Everybody says he has the told to start. Why would he want to be a backup for a guy who takes every single snap all season? He might actually regress in that time. People say he will learn from Manning. I can’t help but point at Sorgi and Painter. They didn’t learn much of anything from watching on the sidelines.

Also, we all use phones and tablets. It’s pretty easy to
correct the spelling.

by PeytonTheManning on Jan 15, 2012 5:21 PM EST up reply actions  

Oh by the way Cam Newton..did a pretty good job..he broke Manning's record

I love Manning wish he could play forever but he can’t and we do not owe him anything, they guy was paid over 172 million dollars to play here, not to bad. It’s dumb to say there is always another once in a lifetime prospect if that was true there would be 32 great QBs playing. Even if there is one, you have to be in position to get him. It’s unfair to say Luck is going to have a bad career, how the heck do ou know ?

by armycolts25 on Jan 13, 2012 1:24 PM EST reply actions  

ITS CALLED OPINIONS!

Ya, Manning was a paid a butt load of money and so are over 50%+ of the Professional Atheletes out there. Was he worth it? EVERY penney! To the fans of the COLTS, to Jim Irsay, to the city of Indy and to ANY fan that knows anything about football. Every year the so called"EXPERTS" anoit some collage hero as the next great wonder! This year it is Luck, next year it will Barkley, The next year it will someone else who is a sure fire NFL prospect! The real truth is less than 50% of them fall flat on there face. That’s why there is not 32 great QB’s in the league! As far as unfair to say Luck is going to have a bad career, how the heck do you know he will have a good one? Are you just listening to the Experts or do you have your own OPINION! Am I not entitled to mine and to share it with others? Oh that’s right, you are the self appointed CEO of the blogs. So, my OPINION is that if the COLTS DUMP Manning and go with Wonder Boy! Enjoy watching in years to come in a half empty stadium because they a sub 500 team! But then agin, that’s just my OPINION!

by shoospa on Jan 13, 2012 3:45 PM EST up reply actions  

I m not saying he will have a good one..but I m not gonna be an ass and not give him a chance

I will enjoy watching as I have done thru the good years and the bad..Manning was once a wonder boy too you know and we saw how that worked out and that’s not opinion its fact.

by armycolts25 on Jan 13, 2012 4:57 PM EST up reply actions  

Facts

http://m.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fharvardsportsanalysis.wordpress.com%2F2011%2F11%2F30%2Fhow-to-value-nfl-draft-picks%2F&h=PAQE_g75a

There you go. The facts say that if Luck is drafted, the Colts should expect Brad Johnson and hope for Peyton. Peyton Manning is the exception as the first pick. Production close to Brad Johnson and Rodney Harrison is the norm. Peyton, even as he declines around 40, will still be miles ahead of Brad Johnson.

by PeytonTheManning on Jan 13, 2012 8:32 PM EST up reply actions  

Confused?

Now you have me confused. First you say we should dump Manning and send him on his way! Now your saying he was also considered a Wonder boy and that it is a FACT how well that worked out! YES I agree it is a fact! So why get rid of him, IF he is healthy?

by shoospa on Jan 13, 2012 10:30 PM EST up reply actions  

The point is that Manning was just like Luck when he came out of college

The same things were being said. Luck may very well be the next Manning, we just don’t know. We have a chance to draft our future, you have to take it.

by armycolts25 on Jan 13, 2012 10:49 PM EST up reply actions  

NEW GM AND COACH

Understood. So you feel the COLTS and there New GM and hopefully new HC are going to stick with the same sytem that was designed specifically for Manning by coaches that are no longer there? I on the other hand feel they will ease into the upcoming change in style of play. Letting Manning work the current sytem while adding quality young talent to help now as well as in the future. New GM has a background in Arena league and Philly(Scramble and run). I think they will look at RG3 or someone in next years draft who is more mobile and develope there own system. Have some seasoned young talent in place for there future and still be competative for Peytons last couple years. Luck is NOT that style of QB. That is why I feel they should pass and get as much for the pick as possible! Just my opinion!!!

by shoospa on Jan 13, 2012 11:06 PM EST up reply actions  

Ummm...

Ryan Leaf…and that’s all I’ll say about that. :<)

by Jim Hinnant on Jan 16, 2012 7:51 AM EST up reply actions  

Man I'm really sorry I did not know that that link is the one true source..wow

I bow before your greatness. I get you love Manning, I do too, just not at your level.

by armycolts25 on Jan 13, 2012 9:05 PM EST reply actions  

More sources

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_first_overall_National_Football_League_draft_picks

There have been 76 guys drafted first overall. 12 are in the Hall of Fame with 3 more likely on their way based on their careers to this point. 15 out of 76. Doesn’t sound like great odds to me. Why give up a Hall of Famer for those odds?

http://www.stampedeblue.com/2011/12/28/2663726/luck-a-guarantee

That is my own research on QBs selected first. Again, the odds are slim that they will even be a consistent starter.

http://drafthistory.com/

This site has an article halfway down the page titled “NFL Starting QBs Typically Drafted in 1st Round; But Nearly Half Don’t Play for Their Original Team.”

It shows where all the current starters were drafted. If we swap Painter for Peyton, only 12 of the 35 were even top 10 picks (he included every QB who qualified for the passing title and TJ Yates). 19 were drafted in the first round.

These are the reasons I want to trade the pick for the estimated 3 first round and 2 second round picks. We can get a quality QB in the first or second round. 23 of the 35 were drafted in those rounds.

This is definitely my opinion. I feel that the Colts should trade the pick. I base my opinion on research and statistics. That is the difference between the “draft Luck” and “trade the picks” arguments. Those who want to draft Luck are hoping for the future. Those who want to keep Manning and trade the picks are looking at it with the logical thought that Manning is the greatest ever, and Luck is a prospect. Why not trade the pick for 5 prospects instead of 1. Every first pick in history had hype around his abilities. 15 of 76 are HOFers. I’ll take quantity over quality when the quality pick has such a low success rate.

by PeytonTheManning on Jan 15, 2012 6:11 PM EST up reply actions  

horrible post

logic would tell you that manning will never play again

by omahacolt on Jan 15, 2012 6:27 PM EST up reply actions  

ANDREW LUCK

isn’t a statistic. He’s one of the most heavily scrutinized college players entering this or any draft. What happened last year or 30 years ago doesn’t mean anything. Every aspect of his game, character and physical attributes will be studied. Scouts and executives who have spent their entire careers evaluating players will have input into the analysis. So far, from everything we’ve seen and heard indicates that he is as an elite a prospect that has been seen in many years. Plus he’s a quarterback and will come at a reasonable price. Is he a sure thing? Of course not. But he is as close as you can get. They’d be crazy not to pick him.

by javen on Jan 15, 2012 7:03 PM EST up reply actions  

Hmmm

I wonder if anybody analyzed Jamarcus Russell, David Carr, Carson Palmer, and Jeff George. They all went through the interviews, scouting, and combine. Scouts and GMs from those teams put their careers behind those picks. None lived up to their hype. Just because social media and the 24 different Sportscenters that are available now talk him up, that doesn’t make him more likely to be successful.

Again, you are basing your argument on the “hope” that he will live up to expectations. Every first pick was supposed to be the next Hall of Famer. Less than 20% lived up to it. Right now, your argument is based solely on hope. You won’t have any actual facts to back it up until 3-7 years from now when he finally has a few seasons under his belt. The fact that a few people have even mentioned that RGIII may have the better career means he isn’t the guarantee everyone wants him to be. There are too many variables to predict his career. If you spread out the risk over five people, you are in a better position to be correct.

by PeytonTheManning on Jan 15, 2012 8:45 PM EST up reply actions  

NOT TRUE

Luck is a much better prospect than any of the players you mentioned. With the exception of Palmer there were serious questions about the talent levels of the other guys. QBs often get drafted higher than they should because of the importance of the position. You can’t win in today’s NFL without one.
The argument isn’t based on hope. It’s based on scouting.

by javen on Jan 15, 2012 10:09 PM EST up reply actions  

Can't win without what?

People are arguing Flacco as an only average QB and Alex Smith is a system guy who is decent but not great. You’re telling me 50% of the championship week teams are QBed by sub-par players that are not considered in the same tier as the elite of this league and players like Rodgers and Brees are out of the playoffs? It doesn’t just take a QB. It takes a team. Everyone has swung from ‘defense wins championships’ to ‘QBs win championships.’ It has been proven that QBs help, but they aren’t the sole owners of those championship rings/trophies/etc,

by AnotherWriter on Jan 15, 2012 10:15 PM EST up reply actions  

what?

the ravens advanced because the texans were on their 3rd string rookie qb

the packers got beat by a really good qb. you dont have to have an elite qb to win a super bowl ring. but it gives you a huge advantage if you do

by omahacolt on Jan 15, 2012 10:27 PM EST up reply actions  

Sam Bradford

He was the next Peyton a couple of years ago. David Carr was drafted to be the “franchise QB.” Luck is a well rounded QB prospect. He also didn’t really improve between last season and this season. That’s one of the biggest predictors of future success.

That’s all really neither here nor there. The fact remains that no matter how much you believe he should be great, it’s nothing more than an educated guess right now. The odds say that he’s more likely to play at Brad Johnson’s level. He very well could be a great QB, but that’s not the most likely scenario. That’s the exception.

If we are just guessing based on our hunches with no facts to back it up, then I’m guessing he tells the Colts he won’t sign with them. That will make this all a moot point. Hopefully, he just tells Irsay, so the team still has a chance of making a quality trade.

Also, I don’t dislike the guy. If they draft him, then I will be behind him and hope for the best down the road. I just can’t accept that he is more valuable than 5 guys with the way our roster looks, and the history of true value from first picks.

by PeytonTheManning on Jan 15, 2012 10:58 PM EST up reply actions  

WHY DRAFT ANYONE?

they are only educated guesses and are likely to bust out.

by javen on Jan 15, 2012 11:07 PM EST up reply actions  

lol

wtf? nobody called bradford the next manning. i am not even reading the rest of your post. you start it out that bad and its over. give up

do we just never draft another qb then? jesus man. horrible post

by omahacolt on Jan 16, 2012 2:18 AM EST up reply actions  

Okay

http://www.nfldraftdog.com/2010-nfl-draft/sam-bradford.html

There’s a guy calling him the next Peyton down under the “Second Opinion” heading.

http://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2010sbradford.php

“Peyton Manning like accuracy”

http://draftboardinsider.com/cgi-bin/prospect.cgi?id=452

“Reminds me of: Peyton Manning”

http://www.draftinsiders.com/node/1104

“Similar to Tom Brady in many of his skills.”

There are a few guys who get paid to analyze players who compared him to Manning and Brady. Every first pick gets hyped up as the next evolution of player at
his position. Make sure you occasionally look things up when you make claims.

I also pointed out that most QBs who are starting today were taken in the first round. I said that we should trade the pick and use one of the five picks we get to draft a QB.

Javen, the reason I want multiple picks is because of the odds of drafting a bust. If you draft five guys instead of one, you drastically increase your odds of finding a quality player or players.

by PeytonTheManning on Jan 16, 2012 10:42 AM EST up reply actions  

Some people here just can't read, or refuse to.

Especially when it fits their argument. Good sources, though. This is what I’m talking about. There are QBs who win games that are not the best taken. Tebow’s horrible play is a testament to the fact that you can even be a sub-par QB and win games in the league.

by AnotherWriter on Jan 16, 2012 5:39 PM EST up reply actions  

who was the last

sub par qb to win the super bowl?

by omahacolt on Jan 21, 2012 6:28 PM EST up reply actions  

Super Bowl 34. Kurt Warner (MVP), 2 TDs
Super Bowl 35. Trent Dilfer (Ray Lewis), 1 TD
Super Bowl 36. Tom Brady (MVP), 1 TD
Super Bowl 37. Brad Johnson (Dexter Jackson), 2 TDs
Super Bowl 38. Tom Brady (MVP), 3 TDs
Super Bowl 39. Tom Brady (Deion Branch), 2 TDs
Super Bowl 40. Ben Roethlisberger (Hines Ward), 0 TDs
Super Bowl 41. Peyton Manning (MVP), 1 TD
Super Bowl 42. Eli Manning (MVP), 2 TDs
Super Bowl 43: Ben Roethlisberger (Santonio Holmes), 1 TD
Super Bowl 44: Drew Brees (MVP), 2 TDs
Super Bowl 45: Aaron Rodgers

Well, depends on whose definition of sub-par we are using, but I’d say Eli Manning, Big Ben, Brad Johnson, and Dilfer weren’t considered elite or weren’t elite when they won their SBs.

If we go back and look at the match-ups in the SB, I think you’d see there are even more sub-par QBs who make that final game:

XXXIV – 1/30/00
Kurt Warner, St. Louis Rams – Northern Iowa (28)
Steve McNair, Tennessee Titans – Alcorn State (26)

XXXV – 1/28/01
Trent Dilfer, Baltimore Ravens – Fresno State (28)
Kerry Collins, New York Giants – Penn State (28)

XXXVI – 2/3/02
Tom Brady, New England Patriots – Michigan (24)
Kurt Warner, St. Louis Rams – Northern Iowa (30)

XXXVII – 1/26/03
Brad Johnson, Tampa Bay Buccaneers – Florida State (34)
Rich Gannon, Oakland Raiders – Delaware (37)

XXXVIII – 2/1/04
Tom Brady, New England Patriots – Michigan (26)
Jake Delhomme, Carolina Panthers – Louisiana-Lafayette (29)

XXXVIX – 2/6/05
Tom Brady, New England Patriots – Michigan (27)
Donovan McNabb, Philadelphia – Syracuse (28)

XL – 2/5/06
Ben Roethlisberger, Pittsburgh Steelers – Miami (OH) (23)
Matt Hasselbeck, Seattle – Boston College (30)

XLI – 2/4/07
Peyton Manning, Indianapolis Colts – Tennessee (30)
Rex Grossman, Chicago Bears – Florida (26)
XLII – 2/3/08
Eli Manning, New York Giants – Ole Miss (27)
Tom Brady, New England Patriots – Michigan (30)

XLIII – 2/1/09
Ben Roethlisberger, Pittsburgh Steelers – (26)
Kurt Warner, Arizona Cardinals – (37)

XLIV – 2/7/10
Drew Brees, New Orleans Saints – (31)
Peyton Manning, Indianapolis Colts – (33)
_________________________________________

You tell me what your definition of sub-par is and we could do a more thorough look. I’d venture a guess that if your good to great QB group is as small as it seems, by your definition a lot of sub-par QBs have rings or have made a Super Bowl. Just on a hunch.

by AnotherWriter on Jan 22, 2012 10:30 PM EST up reply actions  

I love Manning

I wouldn’t mind keeping him. The problem though is that even if he has four more years left in him, it would probably take that amount of time to put together a championship team anyway. We’re not a Superbowl team in 2012 with or without him. Why keep him for a couple of 9-7/ 10-6 seasons and maybe some first round exits, then have to fill that huge hole with god knows who? with that being said, I think taking Luck is the smart thing to do, but I would not be opposed to keeping Manning and busting our asses to try and build something great around him to disprove what I just said, then crossing that qb bridge when we get to it

by Adam McDougal on Jan 13, 2012 10:15 PM EST reply actions  

???

You honestly feel Colts are that far away from competing for a SB? Then how far away are they with an unseasoned Luck at the helm?

by shoospa on Jan 13, 2012 10:33 PM EST reply actions  

Yeah

I think they are at least three years from making any serious noise. I mean, look at how much better the perennial super bowl contenders are, and they’ll likely be getting better, even just a little, every season. with Luck, it depends on how accurate all of the scouts’ projections are and how quickly he lives up to them. If he’s a beast right off the bat, then I’d say they’ve got the same 3-4 years to get into championship shape.

by Adam McDougal on Jan 14, 2012 8:43 AM EST up reply actions  

You can't have your cake and eat it too....

Having Luck and Peyton would be like having two luxury sportscars and living in a house that is falling down around you. You wouldn’t have enough money to build a solid roster, due to salary cap restrictions, to expect to compete for championships if you kept both QB’s. You can only drive one car at a time. One car has no more than 4 years, and that is optimistic, left and cost more than twice as much as the brand new, similar model. Enough analogies… I am for moving on with Luck if a choice has to be made.
My hope is that Peyton realizes that his long term health is the most important factor in his decision to either continue to play or retire.

by thomasezekiel77 on Jan 13, 2012 10:52 PM EST reply actions  

CAP ROOM

Bracket 7.4 mil (Injury prone Angerer is better and cheaper)
Addai 4.76 mil(Injury prone and NOTHING since rookie PB)
Bullitt 3.735 mil(JUST PLAIN BAD!)
Hughs 2.322 mil(Didn’t pan out)
Clark 8 mil( Love ya IOWA boy, but not the same since hand injury)

$26.217 million

NOT counting th obvious let goes Painter, Collins, Lacy, and several others!

by shoospa on Jan 13, 2012 11:17 PM EST reply actions  

DOESN'T WORK LIKE THAT

The savings from cutting the above guys would be less than $5 million in 2012. The savings for 2013 would be far greater.

by javen on Jan 14, 2012 1:05 PM EST reply actions  

Explain

NOT trying to be a dick, But how can these players be scheduled to make over 26 mil and ONLY count less than 5 mil on the cap? I’m NOT a NFL exec or accountant, but that doesn’t seem possible!!!

by shoospa on Jan 14, 2012 7:23 PM EST up reply actions  

you still have to pay them

guaranteed money if you cut them. so cutting them doesnt help the cap much

by omahacolt on Jan 14, 2012 8:02 PM EST up reply actions  

GENERALLY SPEAKING,PLAYERS

usually receive their signing bonus at the time a contract is signed. For cap purposes, the bonus signed divided by the number of years of the contract plus a minimum salary is that players cap hit. If a player gets a $10 million signing bonus on a 5 year contract his cap hit is $2 million plus a minimum salary. If a player is cut before his contract is up the remaining bonus left on the contract accelerates and counts against the teams cap in dead money. So if in the above example the team cuts this player after 3 years of a 5 year contract the remaining $4 million counts as dead money and offsets any savings by cutting the player.
This is the reason cutting Manning now would result in a pretty big cap hit. Picking up his $28 million option and then finding out he can’t play or gets hurt and you have to cut him would result in an acceleration of his bonus, costing the Colts around $30+ million in dead money. If he’s traded the bonus also accelerates.

by javen on Jan 15, 2012 11:30 AM EST up reply actions  

DON'T GET CAUGHT UP

in the contract reported in the press. A lot of times it inflates the value of the actual contract. Agents like this cause it shows how great they are doing for their client. Sometimes a guy will sign for $20 million bonus but only $10 is paid out right away with another $10 million coming in year 5 of the contract. A lot of times it is unlikely that the player will ever see that $10 million. Often times bonuses are based on incentives such as stats, pro bowls etc. If a player doesn’t reach these he doesn’t get the bonus money.
The only thing a player can count on is the bonus money paid to him up front. Once he is cut he’s not entitled to anything else. That’s why these guys hold out for money up front.

by javen on Jan 15, 2012 11:52 AM EST reply actions  

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