Report: Colts Looking To Hire Steelers Assistant Keith Butler As Defensive Coordinator
by Brad Wells on Jan 29, 2012 2:01 PM EST
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New Colts coach Chuck Pagano seems to want to accomplish two goals next week:
- Fill out the rest of his coaching staff
- Weaken the rival of the team he just left to coach in Indy, the Pittsburgh Steelers
Roughly 24 hours after news broke that the Colts will hire former Steelers assistant Bruce Arians as their offensive coordinator, we now get word from Ed Bouchette of the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette that the Colts will interview Steelers linebackers coach Keith Butler for their vacant defensive coordinator position. The Colts fired Larry Coyer during the 2011 regular season, and interim defensive coordinator Mike Murphy retired at season's end.
Unlike Arians, who was run out of the Steelers organization by the Rooney family, Butler is seen by many as the heir apparent to Dick Lebeau, the current defensive coordinator in Pittsburgh. Lebeau is 74, and is considered a legend both as an assistant and as a player. He was a 5th round pick of the Cleveland Browns back in 1959. In 2010, Lebeau was inducted into the Hall of Fame. The Rooneys could force Lebeau to 'retire' just as they did Arians. This way, they could keep Butler and promote him to coordinator.
Butler is scheduled to have an interview with the Colts on Monday, and he told Bouchette that the Colts job "is not a done deal," a statement that has cyncial bloggers like me wondering if Butler is using this interview to leverage the Steelers. He's been coaching linebackers in Pittsburgh since 2003, when Bill Cowher was the head coach. He's also 55 years old, and coordinator jobs like these don't come around that often.
Butler is another 3-4 scheme guy, just like Pagano. If he is hired, say goodbye to the Tampa-2 in Indianapolis, folks.
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Question
Do you actually think we have a defense that can play the 3-4/4-3? In order for this to occur, we must get some big DTs, and some very agile competent CBs to play on the defense. We are a long way from a smash mouth defense, but it’s a good start. We are basically in year 1 of a 2-3 year rebuilding process.
I like this move
Do not like the Arians move
Believe in Blue.
Marshall Manning, Colts QB, 2032-
by stonewall12345678 on Jan 29, 2012 2:08 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Arians
BA has a track record of being good developing young QBs and finding good WRs. He is a good coach except he fails with the play calling during a game. He is not a tremendous OC but he is not horrible either. Most Steelers fans I know are happy he is gone but only if they don’t replace him with someone worse.
anyone trying to contact me via my yahoo account should be aware it has been hacked
by Cold_Old_Steelers_Fan on Jan 30, 2012 12:23 AM EST up reply actions
This
Excellent at getting the most out of his players. Playcalling was sometimes brilliant and sometimes down right miserable
Formerly known as Steeler_
BTSC's token Kiwi fan. That means I'm a New Zealander. Yes, that small country next to Australia....no we are not part of Australia
by Michael Hewitt on Jan 30, 2012 4:53 AM EST up reply actions
steeler fans dont like Arians because he isnt "tough" enough
He calls pass plays, you meathead Pitt fans like “smash mouth football” and running the ball down peoples throats…but when you have 3 stud wr’s and an oft-injured RB running behind a god-awful o-line (which is exactly what pitt has), guess what…you’re gonna throw the ball more!!!
I love the hire, he’ll be a great mentor to Luck. He was Peyton’s QB coach his first 3 years in the league…I think that worked out pretty well! GO COLTS
Come see me after your first RZ trip.
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by John Stephens on Jan 30, 2012 12:47 PM EST up reply actions
or the 20th bubble screen of the season
or 5 wide on 2nd and 3 with a QB who is playing on one leg behind an o-line that resembles swiss cheese.
BA has his strengths but like anyone else, he has some issues.
anyone trying to contact me via my yahoo account should be aware it has been hacked
by Cold_Old_Steelers_Fan on Jan 30, 2012 1:38 PM EST up reply actions
BA's offensive issues have won him a couple SB titles in the past decade with a QB that has half the talent as Manning
I’ll take that any day of the week.
Of course, I was also excited to see us sign Kerry Collins and stick him in front of Curtis Painter as our starter. Regardless, I like the brand of football the Steelers put on the field, and with Andrew Luck coming in I think Arians can do great things.
I am a veteran of the Internet - I will suffer fools gladly. And then mock them. And then post cat pictures.
by BoilerUp1982 on Jan 30, 2012 1:49 PM EST up reply actions
I can’t say that BA had nothing to do with our SB wins, but I think it’s fair to say LeBeau had much more to do with the SB victories. Also, BA wasn’t the OC in ’05.
And nice slight at Ben there. Too bad his fingers will forever be more decorated.
"It’s easy to lie with statistics, but it’s easier to lie without them." -Fred Mosteller
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by John Stephens on Jan 30, 2012 2:52 PM EST up reply actions
I think BA and Luck will work out
Like we have been saying. He is not terrible and he does have some real strengths which I think will play well in your situation.
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by Cold_Old_Steelers_Fan on Jan 30, 2012 3:47 PM EST up reply actions
Tampa-2 is a coverage, not front-7 lineup
And it’s gone, regardless of the DC.
While Butler is a 3-4 guy, he easily could be a hybrid guy.
by Ty46 on Jan 29, 2012 2:15 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
Colts can play 3-4
They will need to draft a NT and sign some
3-4 LBs. Perhaps they move on from Freeney
by (206)NightRidah on Jan 29, 2012 2:18 PM EST via mobile reply actions
it will take a few years
before the colts can play a decent 3-4
There are a bottom 1/4 defense pretty much every year how worse can it get
Hopefully Hughes can amount to something…perhaps they keep Free or Math…They will need to add a couple of larger LBs…
If they get a true NT that has talent it can be done quickly…if not it will be a long conversion
by (206)NightRidah on Jan 29, 2012 2:29 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
they need damn near
all new linebackers and all new dlineman
no matter how it shakes out. it is going to take awhile
I think you come here solely to disagree with people
Houston converted quickly. They do have more talent but the Colts are a bad D so I don’t see how moving to a 3-4 is an issue especially if they can get a NT. I think Drake can play DE in a 3-4 Anderson also…
I’m not gonna argue with you because it’s not worth my time to feed into your negativity
Have a blessed day omahacolt
by (206)NightRidah on Jan 29, 2012 2:39 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
No point in continuing this argument (206)NightRidah
I already fed this troll enough for one day.
Believe in Blue.
Marshall Manning, Colts QB, 2032-
by stonewall12345678 on Jan 29, 2012 2:41 PM EST up reply actions
no i dont come here just to disagree
but do you want me to just say oh yes i agree to every post i agree with. i have agreed with a lot of your posts the last few days. i probably recced a few.
drake is pretty short for a 3-4 de. you can look that up. thats a fact. anderson might be ok. a little light but i think he could do it.
houston had better linebackers and better size than us on the dline. it is very rare for a team to make the switch in 1 year. parcells always called it a 3 year switch
So...
J. Anderson/T. Brayton could play DE. Nevis possibly, or even as a hybrid DT in passing situations in a 4-3 look.
Angerer and Conner are solid LB’s. I don’t think Brackett should be back, but its possible. Wheeler and Hughes are better suited at OLB in a 3-4 then the are for any position in a 4-3. Mathis can definitely be the Terrell Suggs “joker” role in Pagano’s defense.
Not suggesting that it will be an easy transition that will be made over night, but your first comment that “IT WILL TAKE A FEW YEARS BEFORE THEY CAN PLAY A DECENT 3-4” is an extreme exaggeration – one supported with zero analysis.
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Don't waste your time kmbryant
Some people just come here to disagree with everyone logic or not :-)
by (206)NightRidah on Jan 29, 2012 3:10 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
lol
1) i didnt know just plugging in a name was “analysis”
2) anderson maybe as a de. do you really think brayton would be a good 3-4 de? i dont. nevis is short so it would be hard for him to play the position. not saying he cant but he doesnt have the measurables you would normally look at. but you just throw out a name and it must be “analysis”
3) angerer and conner are solid lbers in a 4-3. they dont have the size you normally see with 3-4 mlbers. hughes hasnt proven he is good at anything other than being inactive and wheeler has been horrible outside of this year where he was at best average. you are going to put your hopes in these guys being good at new positions? how is what you said analysis? you just plugged in names
4) it normally takes teams a few years before they can successfully make the transition. thats a fact. the colts would need to make a lot of moves and bring in a lot of new players to make the transition sooner. unless they just plan on sticking square pegs in round holes. which is what you call analysis
nice to see all your NFL expert training paid off. please… you know as much as everyone else stop trying to impress people with your guesses.
yep and will be at every turn omahacolt is
everyone else is safe. he’s like the skip bayless of this blog.
I was actually referencing your presence in addition
You two seem to take more personal shots at others than anyone else here…
by (206)NightRidah on Jan 29, 2012 3:34 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
um yes 206 i know that... thats why i said.... "yep".
the difference is I only take personal shots at this guy ONLY go through my posts and no other fan I get personal
but go through omahacolts posts and routinely he calls everyone an idiot, stupid, etc, etc. i just joined up and already can see he takes pleasure in trying to one up everyone on here.
i disagree with other fans but i RESPECT their view, especially as colts fans i’ve had a fun back and forth with another fan about luck but afterwards we agreed on something else. but this guy is an a** and he knows he’s an a** . there are quite a few on here I talk to off of this site some also living in CA that we meet up for games even and there are dozens more who have left because of guys like him.
of course you would your motto is "your always right"
tell you what… lets see how you respond to other fans future posts starting now. it will last maybe today but come tomorrow the personal shots start again, you just can’t help it.
you can disagree without being an a** i don’t agree with half of what is said but I just smh and move on or put my spin on it. all our crap is opinion anyways no need to get bent if someone doesn’t agree.
by BigMan74 on Jan 29, 2012 3:53 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
booyeah!
love reading this. opinions and what if’s and plain out right what is on our mind. this is the meaning of forums, now i think we can safely say omahacolt your time is UP! you got till the end of the DAY!..
first off it would be "you're always right"
secondly. stop talking about me and get to talking football
see.. he just can't help it
like i said this guy is an a** and always will be. sad thing is… i pity people like this normally.
Are you two ex husband and wife?!
Please be civil for the kids sake!
by (206)NightRidah on Jan 29, 2012 4:27 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
you didn't know
omahacolt is snookie. shes mad at me for not hot tubbing.
but for the kids sake your right 206… the kids DO come first. although sure we’ll still argue about something since she likes living in this freaking trailer park while i want to move to that amazing big city… omaha.
Classic...
You just converted me with that quip
by (206)NightRidah on Jan 29, 2012 4:26 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I'm only relatively new
in Stampede blue.. It didn’t take me long to know about omahacolt. He definitely thinks he’s god speak.
what i find funny
is that people will take whatever i say and just disagree with me because it is me.
yet somebody else comes in and says something like conner and angerer are sure fire 3-4 mlbers and that is “analysis”
what is wrong about my post? how is kmbryants post somehow backed by facts yet mine is laughable even though i look at the past history and what the size requirements usually are for each position. that is a good place to start. is it not.
While I agree with you that it'll take a few years
to build a good 3-4, I think, if we’re look at size being the problem for Angerer and Conner, it’s not as bad as one would think. Angerer is 6ft, 235. Conner is 6ft, 242. Patrick Willis is 6’1, 240. Larry Foote is 6’1, 239. David Harris, Ray Lewis, and Sean Lee are all a little bigger, at around 6’2 and 250. I actually think our ILBs would be okay, if Conner could play inside. Our DL, on the other hand…. Nevis has the weight to play 3-4 DE, but is about 2 or 3 inches short. Our best size fits for 3-4 DE are Matthews and Moala.
"Cat in the wall, eh? Ok, now you're talking my language. I know this game."
-Charlie
by Addai Another Aday on Jan 29, 2012 4:01 PM EST up reply actions
good post
1) angerer and conner might be able to play the middle. i am not so sure. now way they can without a very good nt. which we dont have of course. like i said. typically you would want your lbers to be bigger than our guys.
do you really want moala and mathews playing de? they have the size but i doubt they would be good at it. moala isnt good at all. mathews might be ok. i would work with him
Agreed, I was just saying size-wise.
Matthews has shown more, to me, than Moala. Maybe Moala will fit better in a 3-4? I think Matthews and Nevis would be serviceable. Couldn’t agree more about needing a good NT. IMO, the key to a good 3-4 is ILB and NT. I think that, after QB, it’s a toss up between NT and CB as biggest need. If we can get Franklin or draft Poe, I’d feel better about it.
"Cat in the wall, eh? Ok, now you're talking my language. I know this game."
-Charlie
by Addai Another Aday on Jan 29, 2012 4:14 PM EST up reply actions
A late round sleeper for an athletic NT is this guy
His name is Akiem Nicks.
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/A-sleeper-at-the-EastWest-game.html
Typed enter too soon in the above post :0
Interesting
He has the size to play NT, but watching video, he doesn’t seem like the “space eater” you’d want from one. Actually, he lines up at DE a lot.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9QjwRWvPlDk
"Cat in the wall, eh? Ok, now you're talking my language. I know this game."
-Charlie
by Addai Another Aday on Jan 29, 2012 4:43 PM EST up reply actions
there was some talk when moala got drafted
that he might be better as 34 end. i guess he can’t be any worse than what he has been as a 43 dt.
by BLOODontheTRACKS on Jan 29, 2012 7:03 PM EST up reply actions
Good post indeed
With a 3-4:
NTs: Draft the best available 3-4 NT with our round 2 pick. AJ and Nevis can rotate at NT too, if we play shades of Wade Philips’ 3-4.
DEs: Moala, Anderson – all of those are good run stopping DEs that can contain the edge. Moala has played 3-4 DE at USC. Nevis has the size to do so as well. But then, Nevis can be used as a pass down NT too if we do not play a pure 3-4 or play a Wade Philips like 3-4.
OLBs: Freeney, Mathis, Wheeler, Hughes for the rotation (Wheeler and Hughes will spend more time in coverage)
ILB: Angerer, Conner (If we play a Bill Parcells 3-4, the traditional 4-3 MLB who is good in coverage can become a weak side ILB – Angerer will be weak side ILB while Conner will have more run stopping responsibilities that he is better at) http://www.scardraft.com/Parcells34.html, can work in a Dick Lebeau 3-4 too (http://www.scardraft.com/LeBeau34.html)
But then, elite teams will spread all your LBs out and force you to cover. That is when, having an ILB like Brackett for pass downs will help. Unfortunately, that is the only thing Brackett will be good for, occasional pass downs at this point.
That is also a reason to play 3-4/4-3 hybrid with a 4-3 under defense, to maximize who we have on the roster, IMO.
Let us not forget that Greg Williams did play a 3-3-5 formation for the most part in the SB to provide ample run support vs the Colts with 3 LBs while also having nickel defense in to play the pass with his man corners. The base was still 4-3 but they used a lot of 3 man fronts in their game plan.
Found a pretty good breakdown on BleacherReport
About halfway through they have a good description of sizes you’d want each of your front 7.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/891384-breaking-down-the-3-4-defense
"Cat in the wall, eh? Ok, now you're talking my language. I know this game."
-Charlie
by Addai Another Aday on Jan 29, 2012 4:26 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
If you really have the time, check this out...
Every freaking variation of NFL defenses (read about all 3-4 Ds in there), awesome read. Houston being able to easily adapt to 3-4 was because Bum Philips and Wade Philips play a one gap 3-4 for the most part, easier for 4-3 D-linemen to adapt to thus making it an easier transition.
Moala
Moala should have been a 3-4 DE from the beginning. He fits perfectly.
I don't always drink beer....but when I do, I prefer Dos Equis.
The best system for Moala to fit in is:
Using his degree and not stepping on a FB field
by (206)NightRidah on Jan 29, 2012 10:59 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I think people disagree with you b/c you come off as a huge jerk
it doesn’t matter if you make any sort of qualified point, salient or otherwise – your delivery is curt, you are quick to berate, and offer more freely ad hominem criticisms than actual football information. And some of your opinions make you seem like your football knowledge is either limited or simply not to be taken seriously. For instance, you continually proclaim that Angerer is not a good linebacker – which is absolutely ridiculous.
I am a veteran of the Internet - I will suffer fools gladly. And then mock them. And then post cat pictures.
by BoilerUp1982 on Jan 30, 2012 8:55 AM EST up reply actions
angerer is an ok linebacker
he isnt the next ray lewis though
I don't think he's the next Ray Lewis either
But I do think he’s good enough to start on any team in the NFL, and will be a ProBowler for our team. He still has to get stronger in both tackling without giving ground and coverage, but I think he’s well on his way.
I am a veteran of the Internet - I will suffer fools gladly. And then mock them. And then post cat pictures.
by BoilerUp1982 on Jan 31, 2012 9:01 AM EST up reply actions
he cant start on any team
he wouldnt beat out every mlber. i dont see him making a pro bowl anytime soon
Angerer's on-field playing time hasn't been limited to MLB
He’s played the SAM and WILL positions as well. And in just his second year he finished 2nd in ProBowl voting for linebackers. Another season at least as good as 2011 for him and he’ll get his ticket to Hawaii.
I’m not sure what you don’t like about Angerer, but it really doesn’t make sense. He’s solid, he hustles, he’s a 2nd round draft pick that’s actually panned-out and when prematurely thrust into a starting role b/c of Brackett’s injury he had a breakout season. He’s only 24, and he’s going to still get better.
What don’t you like about him?
I am a veteran of the Internet - I will suffer fools gladly. And then mock them. And then post cat pictures.
angerer
was a horrible olb
just horrible
what i originally didnt like about his is that he was a very bad slber. and he would get dragged for extra yards every time he made a tackle.
he improved that this year. the hype around angerer is way overblown. of course he lead the league in tackles. the colts d was always on the damn field
Lol! This is the dumbest thing I've heard on here
Do people actually try to argue with this moron?
by TheWeasley on Feb 1, 2012 9:36 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
You used logic! Congratulations!
I do believe J. Anderson would be a great fit at DE (3-4). Brayton may be too small, but I’m not TOO worried about Drake Nevis. He showed a combination of strength and quickness as a rookie, I’m not going to sweat out 2 inches…He’s too talented, IMO, to not find a role along a 3-4 line.
You should know that Philip Wheeler played some 3-4 OLB in college, and the Colts experimented with this idea in the preseason – with a TON of success. Obviously Jerry Hughes epitomizes the word “BUST”, but I’m sure you’re smart enough to know that many draft pundits had him pegged as a 3-4 OLB, not a 4-3 DE.
I’m not worried about Angerer. We don’t need him to instantly become Patrick Willis. He’s a tackling machine who’s really developed a nose for the football, something very important from an ILB. I don’t know enough about the position, or Conner, but it’s hard to believe he couldn’t fit in somewhere after the season he turned in.
I think Mathis could/would be a stud in a 3-4 system, and I think he knows he’s perfectly suited for the Terrell Suggs role in Pagano’s defense. I’m not too sure about Freeney, I wouldn’t be shocked if he’s cut.
I’m not arguing they can be a top5 defense next season, or even experience an improvement similar to the Houston Texans. But suggesting that it would take a few years for this defense to even be “defense”, that’s a very vague statement.
Without any off-season acquisitions, I believe this team has SOME personnel to play a 3-4 defense. They have the 2nd most important position covered – the Suggs’ role (assuming they re-sign Mathis). They have a few candidates for DE (Anderson, Moala, Nevis, Brayton?). They have 1 or 2 solid ILB’s (Angerer, Brackett/Conner?). And they have 2, albeit underachieving, candidates to play the LOLB spot – a hybrid role of rushing the passer, defending the run, and dropping into coverage (P. Wheeler and Jerry Hughes. They clearly need a huge NT for any of this discussion to become relevant. But isn’t it nice to actually have an informed, educated discussion instead of just insulting everybody’s ideas?
www.Coltsider.com
check out the new Colts blog!
No way Freeney's cut
We’re not transitioning to the 3-4 as an every down thing. The Ravens weren’t 3-4 in every down. They ran a hybrid 3-4/4-3 defense. Pagano specifically said that he’s not going to try to jam a square peg into a circular hole, which he would certainly be doing if he tried to transition this team to 3-4 every down. When Freeney is you’re best defender, and you go to a defense where he has no position or use, that’s dumb. No way Pagano does that.
by Coltsfan1345 on Jan 29, 2012 4:45 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I think he can definitely make it work...
But whenever a team is in re-building mode, any player scheduled to count $19 million against the cap is never safe.
And yes, Pagano will adjust to the Colts’ personnel, but it’s pretty clear that they will transition to a 3-4 hybrid defense. I honestly don’t think Freeney is suited to play ANY position in a 3-4. He’s too small to play DE, and relies so heavily on playing with his hand in the ground to play as a 3-4 OLB. A truly effective OLB must be able to generate pass rush from a stand-still position, and must possess at least enough quickness to drop into coverage.
OMAHA – I didn’t mean to simply disagree with everything you say. Your previous post detailing the size of your typical ILB’s and DE’s in a 3-4 scheme are a rarity from you. It’s not that you post stupid comments, you just post blunt comments that tell people they are wrong – without any evidence as to why you think they are wrong.
I still disagree that it will be a few years before this defense can be “decent”. I love the Butler hiring – he should help our LB’s out a tremendous amount…and I love the Pagano hiring – he should help our secondary immensely. We definitely need a true NT, some added LB depth, and a few play-makers in the secondary….But I think our defense is markedly better already and we haven’t even added any players. I’m optimistic.
www.Coltsider.com
check out the new Colts blog!
***
As for Freeney – I meant that if he can’t generate a pass-rush from the standing position, and he can’t drop back into coverage, then he is essentially converting a 3-4 defense into a 4-3 defense…which kinda defeats the purpose…
And OMAHA, I welcome analytical (is that a word?) discussions from you any time!
www.Coltsider.com
check out the new Colts blog!
Dude's a troll...
And knows about as much about football as he does about business I see.
Angerer – Conner are fine as outside backers in 3-4. need a junkyard dog MLB this year to finalize that. Converting to 3-4 will be roughest on Freeney. DE’s have to be able to play run in 3-4. Bethea stays at SS, but pretty much the whole secondary has to be rebuilt.
Lets go do what we do.
Uhhh
Angerer is absolutely not suited as a 3-4 OLB. Conner is probably in between, but I think ILb is the easier transition for him.
www.Coltsider.com
check out the new Colts blog!
They need a SS bad
Bethea stays at free safety, but they need an upgrade at SS no matter what defense they are playing. Same goes for corner opposite of Powers and for secondary depth purposes.
I don't always drink beer....but when I do, I prefer Dos Equis.
Indy playing a 3-4.
The way I see it, we would need a true nt. But, we have players like miola, nevis, anderson and brayton that can play de. Our inside lbs I belive will hold up fine. Mathis, freeney and possibly hughes will be able to add pressure from the outside. Our cbs need a major upgrade. Aside from powers, I dont see any cb worth his salt. Bethea will be just fine at safety. But, we will need a polamolu type on the back end. The upcoming draft, free agency and unrestricted free agency could.help fill these holes
If Russia attacked Turkey from the rear, Do you think Greece would help?
by whardiek on Jan 29, 2012 3:36 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Next year's draft class for safety is better
I like both Ray Ray Armstrong and T.J.McDonald for the safety class next year. This year, I like Mark Barron and that is it. Another weak safety class in the draft this year like 2011 draft.
TJ McDonald
Not anything special in my opinion.
by Coltsfan1345 on Jan 29, 2012 4:47 PM EST up reply actions
george iloka ss has looked pretty good
at senior bowl practices or so i hear. has good size too.
by BLOODontheTRACKS on Jan 29, 2012 7:08 PM EST up reply actions
Aubrayo Franklin
DT from the Saints. Fits better in the 3-4 than the 4-3. Wouldn’t break the bank as a FA.
(Only possible if we don’t keep Manning. Given the choice, I’d rather have Manning.)
Yeah, I'm Shure.
The Colts will run the same kind of defense we see the Ravens run: a hybrid of the 3-4 and 4-3.
by TrueBlue87 on Jan 29, 2012 2:19 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Hope it is true
This would be a good hire….If the Steelers think this highly of Butler he must be good….we better lock him up before the Steelers promote him….I hope we have the correct personnel to make this conversion from the Tampa 2 to the 3-4….and Arians better keep the same Manning like offense too….and not all just Steeler like….our O was better than the Steelers O when Manning played…it is crazy of fast the rumors swirl daily….
i think its a requirement that all new coaches, FO personel and players all must have goatees.
this is a hire that shows that Pagano will be the man with the defensive plans. you hire a LB coach since he isn’t bringing in his system like another DC would you bring in a LB coach to carry out your gameplan. pagano is the one with the defensive plans that wreck havoc.
more interested in what arians will do with whatever team is on tap.
Leave our coaches alone
Taking the awful Bruce Arians is one thing but taking Keith Butler is simply unacceptable. Hopefully Butler decides to accept the offer the Steelers are making him as the DC in waiting
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by seton hall and steelers on Jan 29, 2012 2:48 PM EST reply actions
Looks like they've learned their lesson
The Luck era is about to begin, and it looks like they are developing a wise gameplan to GIVE LUCK A DEFENSE!!! I can’t help think what would have been if this organization had given Manning a consistant aggressive defense who’s primary goal was to STOP the other teams and get turnovers!
Manning was getting only 8 or 9 possesion per game with the “bend but don’t break” defense. Imagine what he could have done with the normal 11 or 12 possesions per game if his defense was built to get off the field, as opposed to giving up 65 yard 9 minute fieldgoal drives…
by badtimeoutcaldwell on Jan 29, 2012 2:59 PM EST reply actions
Nice move!
I think this is a good move if it indeed happens. Once again I like the direction we are heading.
"Think wrongly if you please, but in all cases think for yourself" - Doris Lessing
by JohnHandburgers on Jan 29, 2012 3:02 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Real Classy!
The new dumpster divers in the NFL is the Indianapolis Colts. Respect the horseshoe! Yeah this new era is nice. Hiring a bunch of coaches that no one else wanted, Irsay you and your new GM are a match made in heaven. I thought this organization wanted leadership. This coaching staff could not lead a pig to a buffet.
Um dude....
Arians may fit that description, but Butler has been sought by many teams before only to be shot down by Pittsburgh who would love to keep him as “mini” Lebeau. Also Baltimore would have gladly hung onto Pagano if we hadn’t expressed interest in him.
Believe in Blue.
Marshall Manning, Colts QB, 2032-
by stonewall12345678 on Jan 29, 2012 3:16 PM EST up reply actions
You've been drinking that hateraid....
What would you do genius? Sounds like you have all the answers.
"Think wrongly if you please, but in all cases think for yourself" - Doris Lessing
by JohnHandburgers on Jan 29, 2012 3:19 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
in other news...
dave1251 starts the “make peyton manning head coach” campaign as long as he can also keep making those classy commercials.
Arians isn't a terrible coach
He just isn’t a great coach but he does have some strengths. As long as someone else calls the offensive plays during a game he will probably do a good job.
Butler is LeBeau’s heir apparent and Steelers fans are anxious for the Steelers to find some way of keeping him. Maybe something along the lines of making LeBeau an assistant head coach and then promoting Butler to OC.
anyone trying to contact me via my yahoo account should be aware it has been hacked
by Cold_Old_Steelers_Fan on Jan 30, 2012 12:35 AM EST up reply actions
Is that you Jim Caldwell or Bill Polian?
C’mon man, you can’t be serious! Do a little research before you post son.
Anyone else
trusting the decision-makers of this org to make the best choices available to them? I guess I’m part of the wait-and-see crowd. I’m also part of the too-fucking-busy-to-know-THIS-much-about-football crowd. (not a criticism, just an observation that many posters seem to know an insane amount about football and I’m guessing it’s not your professions).
All that being said, I’m excited about the potential success all this change may bring about.
Now it’s time to root on my Hoosiers.
by CoolJohnnieBNasty on Jan 29, 2012 3:43 PM EST reply actions
that is why they call us FAN
we are here as fan of colts hoping for the best. As much as we wanted change, which is now happening, but some change can be for the worse. We could end up like the 49ers when they gave singletary the HC role, one messed up team mentally.
Call this a crazy hunch,
but I think Pagano will be light years better than Caldwell. And, that’s not even saying that much.
My family's housecat (Penny)
Would make a better coach and be more Agressive with more gravitas
by (206)NightRidah on Jan 29, 2012 4:37 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
i disagree
i dont think a cat could succeed in the nfl as a coach. the communication would be off
You're just saying that to disagree!!!
Back up your statement with analysis!
"Cat in the wall, eh? Ok, now you're talking my language. I know this game."
-Charlie
by Addai Another Aday on Jan 29, 2012 4:47 PM EST up reply actions
Our cat says about as much as Caldwell and had superior body language
He also killes spiders in the house…
Advantage Cat
by (206)NightRidah on Jan 29, 2012 4:50 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
LMFAO
+1000
LET THE HATERS HATE.
by INdymayneNVegas on Jan 29, 2012 5:19 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
You want to trade?
LOL. Definitely advantage, your cat, . I’ll trade you my dog that just pisses on everything in the house which kills spiders, cockroaches, in laws and rodents. I’ll even throw in 20 bucks.
Your house
kills spiders, roaches, in-laws, and rodents? That must drive down property value…..
"Cat in the wall, eh? Ok, now you're talking my language. I know this game."
-Charlie
by Addai Another Aday on Jan 30, 2012 2:40 AM EST up reply actions
Agreed
I consider myself a FAN, too. I’m invested. My comment was more directed towards the in-depth knowledge with regards to coaches on opposing teams, defensive philosophies, etc. it’s a new era of fan that I’m still getting used to. Fans know more now than at any time in sports history, in my opinion. Still shocking to me at times.
And just because I’m not as seemingly knowledgable as some fans, I don’t think that makes me less of a fan or less invested.
Hoo hoo Hoosiers!
by CoolJohnnieBNasty on Jan 29, 2012 4:06 PM EST reply actions
Oops
That was for kbreboot reply. My B.
by CoolJohnnieBNasty on Jan 29, 2012 4:06 PM EST up reply actions
i think you are right
with the internet, the sunday package and sirius nfl radio, there is a lot of ways to get information. fans are becoming more knowledgeable. although sometimes you cant tell it by reading this board
Also,
can we get rid of those Delocated ads? That’s just disturbing….
"Cat in the wall, eh? Ok, now you're talking my language. I know this game."
-Charlie
by Addai Another Aday on Jan 29, 2012 4:15 PM EST reply actions
The other day I was sitting in class
and went to SB.
/dear, god!
//slams laptop closed before anyone can see
"Cat in the wall, eh? Ok, now you're talking my language. I know this game."
-Charlie
by Addai Another Aday on Jan 29, 2012 4:23 PM EST up reply actions
adblock
I am a veteran of the Internet - I will suffer fools gladly. And then mock them. And then post cat pictures.
by BoilerUp1982 on Jan 30, 2012 8:57 AM EST up reply actions
I sure hope we get this guy
He’s been preparing to be a DC ever since he got to the Steelers. Learned under Tomlin and LeBeau and coached for an elite defense. This would be a fantastic hire.
If Wikipedia says it, it must be true!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keith_Butler_(American_football)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruce_Arians
"Cat in the wall, eh? Ok, now you're talking my language. I know this game."
-Charlie
by Addai Another Aday on Jan 29, 2012 4:56 PM EST reply actions
3-4?
Do we even have the right personnel to field a 3-4??
I don't think they do,
and I have no idea why they think they can just go through complete transformations on both sides of the ball. There is already a lot of turnover expected for the Offense, now how much of the D is going to have to change? Is this team even going to resemble the old one?
It is what it is
Not it won't
But if Manning indeed is gone and Luck is the starter in 2012, the team is going to suck anyway. So the timing would be right for making drastic changes on defense since the expectations aren’t going to be high for the next season or two.
I don't always drink beer....but when I do, I prefer Dos Equis.
by AceOfSpades on Jan 29, 2012 10:10 PM EST up reply actions
*No it won't
I don't always drink beer....but when I do, I prefer Dos Equis.
by AceOfSpades on Jan 29, 2012 10:10 PM EST up reply actions
Its a hybrid 3-4/4-3 defense
The 4-3 will be an under and not an over
Go Blue!
Revenue - Expenses = Profit
by dezznutz1001 on Jan 29, 2012 7:50 PM EST up reply actions
Pats fan here.... and is this really happening to my favorite rival?
Polians gone..
Peyton is done as a Colt?
Reggie Wayne is likely done as a Colt?
Dallas Clark is probably done as a Colt?
Jeff Saturday is probably done as a Colt?
The Freeney/Mathis age of the Colts Front-7 is done?
If all this is true, then I am sorry guys, because I’ll probably not be seeing you all in the playoffs next year. It’s looking like a complete transformation of the team I’ve come to know so well over the last decade through a weird love-to-hate and a hate-to-love relationship. I hope Andrew Luck can lead the Horseshoe back to prominence, and I really will never forgive Irsay if he causes Manning to end up a Jet.
It is what it is
by Middlesex on Jan 29, 2012 5:13 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Also....
….why can’t they at least trade Manning so they can get a fast-start on rebuilding? Was his contract really that short-sighted?
It is what it is
The cap hit
in doing that is ridiculous.
"Cat in the wall, eh? Ok, now you're talking my language. I know this game."
-Charlie
by Addai Another Aday on Jan 29, 2012 5:40 PM EST up reply actions
Letting Manning walk without getting anything in return
is ridiculous but I hear you. It’s just… amazing that we’re even talking about this.
It is what it is
If we pick up the option
and then trade Manning, the cap hit is something like 38.8m, according to Kravitz.
"Cat in the wall, eh? Ok, now you're talking my language. I know this game."
-Charlie
by Addai Another Aday on Jan 29, 2012 6:12 PM EST up reply actions
one thing is for sure
tom condon is a very good agent
by BLOODontheTRACKS on Jan 29, 2012 7:13 PM EST up reply actions
My first free agent signing would be this guy
Paul Soliai, NT, expected to not be re-signed:
http://www.rotoworld.com/player/NFL/4365/Paul-Soliai
He suits what we are looking for in an NT if we sign him up for a 2 or 3 year deal, IMO.
The other guy I want the Colts to look at is...
…Aubrayo Franklin, whose 1 year deal with the Saints expires and he might be an under the radar acquisition since I felt his value went down once he got into a 4-3 D.
He's not signing anywhere for a 2 or 3 year deal
Soliai’s considered one of the best nose tackles in the game. A lot of teams will be willing to offer him around 4 or 5 year deals.
by Coltsfan1345 on Jan 29, 2012 6:54 PM EST up reply actions
Dont like this
Butler is a seriously good defensive coach, and has been hanging on to be DC in Pittsburgh when LeBeau retires. Not a doubt in my mind that he could be doing it by now and doing it well.
Please dont hire him, we would love to keep him :)
Formerly known as Steeler_
BTSC's token Kiwi fan. That means I'm a New Zealander. Yes, that small country next to Australia....no we are not part of Australia
by Michael Hewitt on Jan 29, 2012 7:30 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Just in case
any of us were inclined to forget…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dDpX8JD7uyA&feature=related
by Ayrshire on Jan 29, 2012 9:22 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Marvin was really good...
They were not the same after he retired
by (206)NightRidah on Jan 29, 2012 9:51 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
manning's release is just ridiculous
Whenever you get stressed, always remember: RDWHAHB
by danorocks17 on Jan 29, 2012 10:36 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah
They should risk blowing 1/3 of the cap if he cant play…
They have no choice under the salary cap structure…
by (206)NightRidah on Jan 30, 2012 12:51 AM EST up reply actions
I think you meant his throwing release so please disregard my foolish comment
by (206)NightRidah on Jan 30, 2012 3:24 AM EST up reply actions
Watching those clips I couldn't help but notice how much better our O-Line used to be :(
Maybe if Polian valued the offensive line a little more, Manning might not have taken the hits which ultimately put him in this position. People used to mock Manning for the way he went down or threw the ball away so quickly to avoid contact, but it’s apparent that he knew (given his brother’s similar neck issues) that self-preservation of that sort is the only way he could stay in this league for as long as he has.
I am a veteran of the Internet - I will suffer fools gladly. And then mock them. And then post cat pictures.
by BoilerUp1982 on Jan 30, 2012 9:52 AM EST up reply actions
polian valued the offensive line
but he was just horrible when drafting for it…
by BLOODontheTRACKS on Jan 30, 2012 5:26 PM EST up reply actions
He was good at calling it out though, after the super bowl loss..
and then drafting Jerry Hughes to fix it.
Yeah, I think you're right
Pollack, Richard, Ugoh come to mind as higher draft picks that are considered by most to be busts (although Ugoh is playing for the SB-bound Giants – go figure).
I am a veteran of the Internet - I will suffer fools gladly. And then mock them. And then post cat pictures.
by BoilerUp1982 on Jan 31, 2012 9:03 AM EST up reply actions
Fingers are crossed...
I hope they get Butler. Bring in a Defensive HC and a guy who should’ve been DC 3 years ago, might even get some of the elite guys around the league wanting to come play Def for us, not just the hodgepodge of wannabes that play for us now?!
"But a true champion, face to face with his darkest hour, will do whatever it takes to rise above. A man fights, and fights, and then fights some more. Because surrender is death, and death is for pussies!" ~Kenny Powers
The new direction of the Colts has me very excited for the future
We aren’t just bringing in defensive-minded guys – we’re bringing in defensive-minded guys who have won in this league, and who have a track record. It looks to me like Irsay is on a mission to build a complete team with formidable strengths on both sides of the ball by actually going out and getting the best coaches and coordinators available, and not just promoting from within for the sake of “continuity.” And Andrew Luck at the #1 overall pick is simply the icing on the cake.
Not only are the Colts building a new team with the next elite QB at the top – they are also building a team that will be able to win when he’s not having a good day by the looks of the defensive guys we’re bringing in. This is exactly how championship teams are built. They are well-coached and balanced, and with Dick Lebeau’s successor in the fold at DC, the vaunted Raven’s D-Coordinator at HC and an offensive talent like Andrew Luck running the offense, I think Irsay is setting up the Colts for another decade of greatness.
Expect the Colts to make some serious moves on draft day – I know we’re drafting at the top of each round, but I’ve read comments in here saying that we’re getting a few compensatory picks as well. If there’s a player hanging out there that we want, the Colts are going to trade and maneuver to get him – and I also expect to be active in Free Agency. Irsay is going to want this team to hit the ground running, and I expect the bounce-back to contention to be much shorter than most would expect with a rookie QB and new coaching staff.
I am a veteran of the Internet - I will suffer fools gladly. And then mock them. And then post cat pictures.
by BoilerUp1982 on Jan 30, 2012 9:07 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
exactly. a dynasty is being built and this time we will win more than 1 SB!!!
by coltsgolfbeer on Jan 30, 2012 4:56 PM EST up reply actions
that is one of the worst things about Peyton being retired
with better management , drafting and coaching he should have won at least 2 more SBs
by OBGYNOSUPREME on Jan 30, 2012 7:37 PM EST up reply actions
I hope the Colts pick up Butler
It would be awesome to see the Colts pick up Butler. Some people said that the Colts couldn’t convert right away to a 3-4 defense. That’s probably true, but it’s a rebuilding process and with the Colts routinely ranking around 29th in defense, how much worse could they get? I hope Butler joins the staff. As far as Arians, I’m not so hyped about him. Granted, it sounds like he’d be good for mentoring Luck. That’s the main reason I think he’s been brought in, that and the Steelers have won two Super Bowls this past decade. But with the talent that the Steelers had on offense, they could have done far better than ranking middle of the pack. To me, the hiring of Arians semi-hilights the fact that Manning will likely not be back as much as I don’t want to accept that.
by ColtsFanInEnemyTerritory on Jan 30, 2012 9:15 AM EST reply actions
Coaching staff is looking great
we made a good trade with Balt we took Pagano and they took Caldwell – HUGE- ADVANTAGE- COLTS,,, if I had been a HC, I could never go back to being a position coach , would have to be an OC or DC
Not so fast...
It was just announced on Twitter that Butler will stay with the Steelers
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